My wife and I are having our carpets replaced next week. That means getting everything off of our existing carpets. Today I was working away in the room where I keep many of my books and most of my files.
After taking all of the files out of a cabinet that includes correspondence I want to keep, I saw a single sheet of paper lying on the rug where hanging folders used to be. It must have fallen out of a manila folder and sat there unnoticed for quite a while. I’d penned in a date on the lower right corner: Sept 2018
Reading it, I understood why I kept it. I don’t know whether the unsigned message came in the form of an email, letter, or blog post comment. All I know is that the message made me feel really good, as sentiments like these keep me going on this blog whenever I start to think, maybe I’ve said all that I need to say.
Here’s the message, just as it was written.
…I’d like you to know that you are loved and respected by so many people in India, and in the UK. Your consistency of thought and logical assumption surpasses the expectations of a tribe who has come to know and love that you are, indeed, practicing the gospel of spiritual freedom and independence. I’m in tears every time you write about your health, simply because you are a pillar of strength to me and to so many who may not reach out to you, or don’t know how to… but just the fact that you can so articulately outline the reasoning that so many of us truly need…
that’s enough for all of us to go to bed safe in the know that the conflicts that abound in our hearts are normal… and that’s so much in itself, so much that you have so selflessly given all of us. I speak on the behalf of my mother, and my Aunt… both went from warning me about you, to telling me how honest you are… and that, for me, is the most important approval. Here was a man I had never met, but whose book (Life is Fair) was a bedtime favourite, and when he started openly discussing why the 35 years in RSSB weren’t enough to blindly believe… the liberal in me was tickled.
I was a long time observer, but it took me an age and some serious gumption to write my first comment on the COTC. There was never going to be a looking back… I vowed to drop the pseudo-spirituality and to start bettering myself as a person… a practice I’ve stuck to ever since the day I realised that I’m actually clueless, and alone, and a speck of cute smugness that has absolutely no idea of how the universe functions. It has been a journey, Brian. I may not write in for a year (that’s never going to happen again) but not a day passes when I don’t think of you and the profound impact that you’ve had on my life and the authenticity that I’ve cultivated as a result of it.
I can probably say that you’ve been my hero, the one person who has given me so much strength… …strength, not just to deal wth the debunking of a belief system, but a strength that has permeated every aspect of my life and has radically changed my worldview and the way I respond to life. I’ll reserve my heartfelt gratitude for a much awaited personal meet-up in Oregon. You are my beloved shining star, I will live in gratitude for the rest of my life… …and I thank the Almighty (…if he/she exists) for giving me a glimpse into your beautiful mind. There is so much unconditional love that you have evoked within the hearts of the ones who have found a friend in your writings… even the RSSB’ers feel that you are a force to reckon with. I’m proud of you my friend.
Aw, thanks. All I can say is that I deeply appreciate your appreciation. And that if you really knew me, as my wife and dog do, you’d know how flawed I am. That’s the honest truth. But since you said you approve of honesty, I do aspire to that. Imperfectly, like how I pursue everything in life.
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Nice. I’m rereading Treasure Beyond Measure by Shanti Sethi now. The last rssb book to be published just before Charan Singh died. For some reason I thought he wrote it but I was wrong. So see I can make mistakes too honestly. It talks about haughtiness and how inappropriate it is. I’ve lovingly referred to the book before as Treasure Beyond Gurinder because that’s what it meant to me.
Always nice to be appreciated. No doubt your posts have helped people to ease away from reliance on spurious spirituality.
What I appreciate about your blog is that the topics and reviews of science issues and books that throw a different light on spirituality give me the chance to engage intellectually with their contents. At my age (85 and counting), engaging in such mental activity, I feel, helps keep the brain healthy – better than doing sudoku, crosswords, etc. for me.
Personally, much, if not all, of what goes for spirituality and religion has faded from my life, so I can appreciate and align with many of the reviews and mental musings that are posted here without the influence of ingrained beliefs interfering – despite having opinions, etc.
I do value living as just being a human being with the numerous personal peculiarities I have been born with and acquired, along with, of course, the here and now sensory information that flows through me unbidden to form my world.
Although it’s fun and interesting to read and comment on the various topics raised here, I’m happy to know that what science is unable to answer (or believes it has answered) and where the spiritual traditions often say that they ‘know’, much, including the infamous inquiry of who/what I am, is unknown.
The viewpoint has to change.
It’s been a long time since I commented on here. It is because something is becoming abundantly clear, which almost everyone misses.
Sant mat is changing – that is OLD NEWS. You must be living under a rock if you missed that one.
But here is FAR FAR MORE to this.
Let me narrate an incident.
I went to a satsang. I listened to the two talks, both emphasizing meditation. Then questions were invited. I went to the mic.
What happened next will left everyone dumbfounded – as it should.
My question as simple.
I said:
go to youtube, under the GSD Q&A and look at video no 111.
this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhUq4RQ56Bs&t=168s
I said “the questioner said he wants to realize God, so he meditates”
then i paused.
“Even before Babaji answered, he was shaking his head.
Then he spoke and said in no uncertain terms:
“You can NEVER do it.
The moment you said “I WANT TO MERGE WITH GOD – FINISHED”
BabaJi said that You are ALREADY ONE with God, there is no separation.
No merging is needed.
AS LONG AS YOU THINK YOU ARE SEPARATE – END OF SUBJECT”
at this point, everyone in the hall must be wondering what is going on.
I won’t bore you with all the details, but I explained that Baba Ji said there
is NO POSSIBILITY of MEETING GOD (whether through meditation or any other method)
WHY?
Because it is a REALIZATION of what ALREADY IS.
NOT an acquisition of some fictional God. Not a merging.
I invited the speaker to comment.
Of course there is no comment that can be made.
The only honest answer is:
“We have all misunderstood the teachings”
Of course nobody can admit that. In which case, the question is:
Is anyone even listening to the man they call their guru.
The only answer is NO.
What Babaji is saying is that “There in only ONE”
This is advaita, and it matches what Gurbani and all the saints have said.
We have added the duality.
I explain it here in detail
https://www.facebook.com/reel/1382086400524250
and here.
https://www.facebook.com/reel/1061466906340103
this is from a gurdwara talk i gave. it was an open discussion group.
This changes everything from “I AM TRYING TO ATTAIN”
to
“God is ALREADY the case. no attainment is needed”
This is what BabaJi is teaching. Not duality.
here’s a few more snippets
https://www.tiktok.com/@onelight71/video/7664814883329887510
https://www.tiktok.com/@onelight71/video/7658548169109720342
https://www.tiktok.com/@onelight71/video/7654432173981830422
This changes everything because it means
Everyone has misunderstood the core message on sant mat.
It has nothing to do with mediation, attaining, regions, realms, sach khand,
or the guru coming at death. Those are the misconceptions.
To some, this fallacy of meditating – or whatever – in order to find God or enlightenment is well known.
There is the tale of the student sitting long hours in meditation. The teacher picks up a tile and starts rubbing it with a cloth. The student asks him “What are you doing,?” “I’m polishing this tile to make a mirror” he replies. ” No amount of polishing will make that a mirror” the student retorts” ” No amount of meditation will make you a Buddha” said the teacher.
Just tuning in to what Osho Robbins is on about:
“There is NO POSSIBILITY of MEETING GOD (whether through meditation or any other method)
WHY?
Because it is a REALIZATION of what ALREADY IS.”
There is (apparently!) a difference between a realised soul and an unrealised soul. One has realised that he and ‘God’ are one, and the other one hasn’t.
So to say if you have not ‘realised’ (and want to) that you are FINISHED is just a bit plain language semantics.
Our minds (can’t speak for everyone but can speak for mine) have not ‘realised’ many many things. So what leads to a realisation ?
If you have never been hungry and without food perhaps the statement that food keeps you alive, means nothing. If you experience severe hunger perhaps that’s what makes you realise ?
If you’ve never been dead (meaning this present mind has not experienced death or can’t remember it even if it has been (dead)), then it does not mean much. Even though the mind produces fears and reactions when the thought appears.
Similarly the thought/idea of ‘merging with God’ is a bit ridiculous- it’s all idea without experience.
But to say every mortal whose mind has not ‘realised’ that is FINISHED is not very clever.
So Osho, are you agreeing with Gurinder’s approach (thus Sant Mat has changed) or agreeing with me that not having realised yet is not hopelessness ?
Eric,
excellent comment.
No, i am not saying “you’re already ONE – so relax”
nor is GSD.
his “finished” referred to the chances of success. He said “if you consider yourself to be separate then you cannot succeed (you’re finished = no chance)”
what He means is: as long as you start with the PREMISE that there is a ME, and another entity called GOD, then you have exactly zero chance of success, whether you meditate or do any other practice.
so what is REALISATION?
It is not a belief – not something you hear.
it involves a number of stages.
1. let go of the false idea of a separate God somewhere – there is none
2. There is nothing except the ONENESS – there is no other possibility. it is important to understand that this is not a teaching – not a belief – it is something you have to personally discover – not believe
3 This leads to UNDERSTANDING – which is not the endgame. it is only a halfway house. i always say “understanding is the booby prize”
4. understanding is of the mind. There is a reason why scriptures have always said you need a living guru. not to give you initiation, or to entertain you – but to challenge you so you go beyond the “me” – beyond what is called haumi (the sense of me as a separate self).
5. Realisation happens in the presence of a master – it is a living state – not a theoretical concept.
GSD only hints at this rarely because there are very few true seekers.
most people never get beyond the first step: they see god as separate from ‘me’ – and are trying to ‘merge’.
That is what Gurinder Singh is saying “finished, no chance” to.
if you start with “I am separate” then you remain separate,
the questioners follows up with “trying to dissolve myself”
Gurinder says “no, because again you are starting with two”.
In the old days, prior covid, people would say to me that i have misunderstood – but now we have the Q&A so anyone can see he really is telling people to realize oneness
“Similarly the thought/idea of ‘merging with God’ is a bit ridiculous- it’s all idea without experience.
But to say every mortal whose mind has not ‘realised’ that is FINISHED is not very clever.” – Eric
The word God is misunderstood.
As long as “God” means a separate being somewhere – there can be no realization.
This is why realization cannot happen through normal means.
You have to drop all the ideas you have collected, such as “i am here” and “God is in Sach Khand”
until you drop that notion – you will remain in the state of seeking a fictional God.
Hi Osho,… you still haven’t convinced me that there is only ONE, and we are IT.
I am deeply grieving the loss of my dear Wife less than a month ago, which really has had a huge effect on my present Life view going forward.
I have now been alone in my apartment for over 2 months, counting when my Wife first went in the hospital than Nursing Home, Hospice then death, as I watched her slip away every day to her very last breath.
During that time, my only comfort was, I went back to deep meditation that I had quit several months ago prior, but I prayed a lot as well, but only that The Lord would have mercy on her and and take away her pain. I never prayed for healing for her, as I knew that would have required a Miracle that just no longer happens in our cruel world.
I have been re-listening to the old Q & A Charan Singh talks,…which give me hope. That my 35 plus years of meditation and trying to follow the Sant Mat Path was not in vain, or wasted years, as Gurinder Singh and you teach, or at least agree on, that there are no Inner Regions, no Sach Khand, no Master will come for us at death, there is no where else to go, because we are already there, no matter if we are dead or alive.
Why any human with even a tiny particle of Spirituality could feel any Joy, or Hope believing such lifeless, negativity, is far beyond me. Just scanning ANY Scripture writings of ANY of the past Mystics as well as Sant Mat Masters , including Sar Bachan Prose deeply refutes Gurinder Singh’s and your Oneness teachings.
Of course, loosing my Wife so suddenly, could be effecting my understanding, as she was diagnosed with aggressive stage 4 Ovarian cancer on June 12. and died July 11th!
In a Charan answer to a lady who asked if she would see her Husband who died ever again, he told her to forget her husband , because he was gone forever! So, that answer does line up with your Oneness doctrine.
But I just can’t wrap my head around becoming realized to know that there is only ONE, with out Form, Sound, or much of any thing, and every Sentient Being on earth as well as the Universes within Galaxies are not Multi, but ONLY ONE.
I challenge any Reader who has ever lost their Spouse, or has yet to loose them, can find even the faintest remote second of Joy, Love or Hope believing such thoughts.
How is it ever possible to sincerely Love some thing you have never seen, nor ever hope to see, and never will?
Hi Jim,
First of all, my deepest condolences on the loss of your wife. It is a very difficult time and painful to go through when you have spent so much time together.
I completely appreciate your viewpoint. ONENESS does not give hope.
This video might be helpful or unhelpful depending on how you view it.
The individual seeks meaning, hope, love, joy.
What Jim Newman calls “WHAT IS” offers nothing. The individual does not like it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucFLwbNcy2U
maybe this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUIRWEip1us
different viewpoint.
BUT the real point is this:
ONENESS is not a teaching, a theory, a philosophy. It is a discovery of what IS.
so here Tony says “it is unknowable”
Not sure if this helps. I agree that sar bachan teaches regions.
so does the RSSB book Mysticism Vol 2.
The more recent RSSB books point to oneness.
such as “ONE BEING ONE”
Thanks, Osho. I “assume” as a Oneness Preacher/Teacher, you completely disagree, or at least, are in odds with most of Anon’s posts.?
I think the confusion regarding One and Many is confusing Kal/Brahm/Lucifer with Anami Purush, or the Supreme Being Who the Biblical Jesus Christ referred to as his “Father”, ….of Who sent him, was in him, as he was also in Him. So Jesus and His Father were ONE and ONLY.
In Sant Mat as well as Theosophy teachings, “Our” separation as humans, as you well know, consists of Physical, Astral, Causal, and Spiritual, each even consisting of multiple levels with in each ,….or simplifying it even further, as The Apostle Paul wrote,….Absent from the body, present with the Lord” .
So, in essence, either my Wife’s remaining “Essence” is either now Astral, Causal, Spirit, or none of those, but now absorbed in the only ONE.
So will any part of what’s me, ever see any part of what’s her again? Guess Charan Singh’s stock answer that always applied, will have to also apply for me; “He Knows Best.”
The very last words my Wife scribbled on a little note book, the day before she died, was,….”I am no more me.”
She was seeing some thing I couldn’t see the last 2 days. She would suddenly raise both arms towards the ceiling, as if she was trying to grab some thing, or push some thing away. Hospice workers on line say this is a normal occurrence.
Hello. I am sorry for your loss. You sound like a good man that truly cared for her to the end. I wonder what she meant on those last words? Perhaps, she was reaching up her arms to hug. She sounds like a spiritual woman.
Yes, “He knows Best” is a great comment the Master wrote. I like it when he raises his hands upward.
Thank you for sharing…
Hi Jim:
You cited something I guess OSHO wrote?
“as Gurinder Singh and you teach, or at least agree on, that there are no Inner Regions, no Sach Khand, no Master will come for us at death, there is no where else to go, because we are already there, no matter if we are dead or alive.”
This is really a misunderstanding. There are most certainly higher regions of consciousness, higher planes, exactly as Swami Ji wrote. Part of self-realization and then God-realization is raising consciousness to see this. You will see your Master when your consciousness is at that level.
The higher regions all encompass the lower regions. Therefore, at each level, you see that they were already in you.
But to get to that level, yes, there is the journey. We are moving from not knowing to Knowing. And that is a journey of awakening.
Alak, Agam, Anami, all very, very real. Immense, beyond description. Anami: A Sea of light and pure love. We are all there, in source. Let’s go back!
All contain everything below. In that pure region, no words, no descriptions, all is One.
We already know, and physics teaches this, that you and I aren’t really separate beings. We are different ripples in the same large quantum field. We are already One. But to realize this, to witness it, that is the spiritual path.
Your wife, like a ripple on a nearly infinite sea, has simply moved on. Just as you and I are already doing whether we see it or not.
And that also means two things. 1. You and she never lost your connection. It persists, in whatever forms you and she may take. Letting go is simply not hindering her progress that even Master is shaping.
2. You have a Master, a connection to the higher power, that is very, very carefully helping both you and your wife. A part of her will never leave you, Jim. The connection cannot be altered in any way. And she carries a part of you onward with her. Letting go is simply letting God do his work.
3. Meditation will gradually bring you to peace. And Peace is the only answer the human mind can possibly believe or understand. So, do as Baba Jaimal Singh instructed Huzur Sawan Sing: Don’t get up from your meditation until you have tasted the nectar. Bring your sadness and loss to Him, realize this will take time, and continue in good faith.
Faith is indeed the noblest of all human qualities, because it is precisely when you cannot see, when you are suffering in the midst of tragedy, that faith pulls you forward. Faith is in you, Jim:
“13 All these people were still living by faith when they died. They did not receive the things promised; they only saw them and welcomed them from a distance, admitting that they were foreigners and strangers on earth. 14 People who say such things show that they are looking for a country of their own. 15 If they had been thinking of the country they had left, they would have had opportunity to return. 16 Instead, they were longing for a better country—a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.”
Hebrews 11: 13-14
Also, Jim, there is not even one syllable of difference between the teachings from all the Saints, including Baba Ji Gurinder Singh and Huzur Jasdeep Ji. No sunlight between any of them. They emphasize different things, that is all. Same teachings throughout all time, and across most religious beliefs, including Christ, if you investigate deeply enough. They are all beacons of the same light, Jim.
“Sister, we are all following Christ.”
Maharaj Charan Singh Ji
Thanks Spence. Very inspiring comments. You and I aren’t very far off, from our beliefs.
Jim Sutherland says he is not convinced. i am not trying to convince. That is not the process. This is the difficulty that is difficult to communicate.
EVERYTHING is a belief and a teaching. Hence there are teachings that say,
1. YES, There IS a soul
2. NO, There is NO SOUL
3. There ARE regions and a sat purush etc
The Enlightenment path is different.
It is not another teaching even though everyone thinks it is.
It is radically different. it gives no comfort.
It comes as a discovery. so it is not a matter of what anyone says.
If someone is saying it – it will not help you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xggTJCCxFss&t=60s
In this video there is a big clue.
You have to drop all prejudice.
Forget whether you like Osho or not.
Just listen to what he says very closely.
He reveals the mystery but only if you listen closely.
He is not saying he does not believe in god.
He is saying is it IMPOSSIBLE for there to be a GOD
because he KNOWS it, not as a theory or idea,
But you don’t know it – so you cannot accept that HE does.
How can he, it is impossible to KNOW.
It is not – but he is not talking about a teaching or even an experience