I first heard about David Chapman in 2011, when I wrote “David Chapman’s dizzying writings on Meaningness and Buddhism.” That post starts with:
I don’t often use the word “dizzying.” Especially in the title of a blog post. Here, I mean it as a compliment, in the sense of… giddy, bewildering.
Those are good things when it comes to writings that attempt to get at What Life is All About. Because if we think we understand what life is all about, we don’t.
Today someone sent me an email.
“Wanted to make sure you’ve seen this one: http://meaningness.wordpress.com as he is a wonderful writer *and* touches on subjects that seem to be dear to your heart.”
Instead of reading a book during my pre-meditation time this morning, I perused that link on my laptop.
Wow. Dizzying.
I later thanked my correspondent for turning me on to David Chapman, saying:
“Thanks a lot for the link. I’ve read several posts/chapters and am blown away by this guy. He’s like a more intelligent, more scientific, more coherent, more wise version of me who also can write a heck of a lot better. And has a great sense of humor. I’m an instant David Chapman fan. I’ll probably put up a blog post tonight about his writings.”
Impressively, Chapman has a Ph.D. in Artificial Intelligence. In December 2023 I bought Chapman’s book Better Without AI: How to avert a moderate apocalypse… and create a future we would like. I started to read it, then set it aside, as back then AI wasn’t much on my mind. Or the minds of most people.
This morning, though, I started re-reading the first 100 pages of the 200 page book that I’d read before. AI has been very much in the news recently, what with dire warnings coming from experts in the field who are alarmed at how AIs have been displaying disturbing behaviors and a rapidly growing intelligence.
It’s agency that freaks people out. That’s the capacity to do things. Chapman writes:
An agent AI tries to do things in the real world. That may involve gathering information, building mental models, forming intentions based on desires or goals, reasoning and making plans, and taking action. Agency is what makes AI scary, for most people who do find it scary. For many people who don’t find AI scary, it is because they believe it is impossible for machines to try to do things, or to have desires or intentions.
…”Superhuman performance” is not scary. It’s what computers are for. It’s been achieved for a zillion tasks since the 1950s. It’s also completely out of reach for zillions more tasks we’d like done.
The promise, and the threat, of “artificial general intelligence” is that it could do everything. That could deliver either fully automated luxury communism or human extinction.
Taking it as a threat, “AGI” is often equated with Scary AI. This is a mistake. All three terms in “AGI” are inessential for an AI apocalypse.
- Superhuman intelligence is not threatening per se; it is risky only if it produces superhuman power.
- Superhuman powers created with AI are risky whether they are wielded by artificial agents or natural humans.
- A superhuman “narrow” AI capable only of devising extraordinarily effective bioweapons could cause human extinction. On the other hand, full generality in AI is a fatal flaw. Computer science often discovers inherent trade-offs between generality and efficiency. For deep mathematical reasons, any AI system that can solve all problems in theory must be incapable of solving any problem in practice, because it would take much too long.
This got me to thinking about another form of supposed “superhuman performance” — gurus, mystics, shamans, and others who are believed by their devotees to have supernatural knowledge and abilities that far surpass those of ordinary people.
I’m not shy about criticizing religious personages who are considered to be Jesus-like, being viewed as God in Human Form. Such as Gurinder Singh Dhillon, the guru of Radha Soami Satsang Beas, an organization that I belonged to for 35 years before I saw through the spiritual B.S. that I’d once embraced.
For the past 20 years or so I’ve spoken my mind on this blog about the importance of being spiritually independent, assuming someone has a desire to be spiritually anything at all. (I’m finding that “spiritual” has little meaning for me in my current atheistic frame of mind.)
Frequently I’ve been told by commenters on my posts that I will have to pay for my criticism of the RSSB guru, because God will punish me for disrespecting His beloved “son.” Yawn… That’s my response. I’ve spent less time worrying about this than about a hangnail I sometimes get on one of my big toes. The main reason is what Chapman spoke of above.
Even if something or someone has superhuman intelligence, that isn’t risky unless the superhuman intelligence is accompanied by superhuman power. Since there is no convincing evidence any person possesses superhuman/supernatural power, I have no concern that my (nonexistent) soul is going to be zapped by some (nonexistent) power wielded by a (nonexistent) divine human being.
And neither should anyone else have such a concern. I’m doing just fine, even after writing posts such as:
Curse God freely. Then, laugh.
God, go to hell
Why believe a guru can do supernatural bad if the guru can’t do supernatural good?
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When we asked for initiation into rssb we had to have humility right there and preferably an open heart with some repentance thrown in for religious purposes. So now you have a new daddy Ai and the fake gurus and thinkers as well as social misfits were all the prototype for Ai , the biggest fake news organization on the planet. And on another note if you can’t love the Master then hate him as much as possible because this also creates attachment. Brian is still super attached and I admit everyone else on the page is too. Later on I’ll tell you what Paul McCartney said about Gurinder. And vice versa. I’m more like Charan Singh who never wanted to be the Master . These current clowns wanted and want. I just like to make money for nothing and chicks for free. Just that in itself makes me master if I could only learn to love again. 😂
“Frequently I’ve been told by commenters on my posts that I will have to pay for my criticism of the RSSB guru, because God will punish me for disrespecting His beloved “son.””
This is really worrying. But I’m not surprised. This is exactly what had been said by writers on here and this is what RSSB people do – the spiritual policing, the bullying, the control, the shaming. They won’t leave you alone. They are honestly no different to islamist /muslim fundamentalists who won’t take criticism of their prophet and insist on making others follow their rules and policing others. It’s the same energy.
I’ve spoken with Jasdeep just a few months before his official appointment, but he already knew. We of course talked about Gurinder as well and his take is. Well he might not be a spiritual master in the way that Jesus and others were but he has spread enlightenment to his followers. Or something like that. Then he wanted to know how much I meditated after I cussed at him Sawan style. Then he wanted to tell me I should give up women at my age. Oh yeah I thought I was talking to Gurinder at first till he told me his age. I told him some of what Gurinder had told me and he said he thought an American Master would be great. He asked if I was personally initiated by GSD ( like he was ).He kind of likes the French people though especially the women I think. I didn’t ask about his wife . But the man was full of advice. I told him what Gurinder told me. ” I’ll ask for advice when I need another vice “. Anyway sure enough now he’s on stage giving it. I’ve met them all before they were famous! I knew Clifford Antone too . I don’t have to mess with the middle men. They literally have no control over me. Bullies cringe. I just initiated two of them yesterday. And speaking about not wanting to be master. I had no problem relaying that message to GSD because like Um said. Being a master is something determined by God and it’s an inner connection that even GSD can’t break. So I’m not worried about making it official or not because that’s just more neighbors , more problems if it does happen. All I can do is go on the front porch and wave a flag. But I don’t want to. So I won’t
I’m so thankful for this blog where possibly one other person will know what I mean
https://scienceofthesoul.org/books-EN-020-S.html
Why are you posting links to RSSB books on an ex-RSSB blog for those who left? This is forceful preaching. RSSB says don’t do this.
It’s okay if you wrote the book or cared what they say. 😂 They said don’t get on social media too and I met Jasdeep on Instagram originally 🤣 he was a big-time internet influencer didn’t you know ? I never left. I do it for me like I do seva. In fact that’s all I do all day is seva. This is Brian’s seva. Short answer is as if I care what rssb says. I don’t work for them anymore but they work for me.🥰🥰
The tacit theme here is that RSSB is a religion that preaches karmic retribution for detractors of its guru.
But aside from Chachaji (Swami Shiv Dayal’s brother) saying that the “miseries and sufferings multiplied” of fellow caste members who tried to get them excommunicated, I know of not even the slightest instance of an RSSB guru preaching karmic retribution for critics of himself, past RSSB gurus, or RSSB itself.
Funny thing though, other Sant Mat-style gurus that spun off from RSSB did employ karmic retribution threats against guru critics and apostates. I’m referring here to John Roger of MSIA, Twitchell, Gross and Klemp of Eckankar, and even Kirpal Singh.
Kirpal had a correspondence feud with his initiate Twitchell, and is reported to have remarked: “Everyone is born with a rope around their neck, and his (Twitchell’s) is getting short.” Remarkably, Twitchell died not long after that at the relatively young age of 62.
No doubt RSSB has satsangis that believe criticism of the guru will result in divine punishment. But that’s a belief that has never been promoted by RSSB itself.
Sant 64 than they did not pay much attention to what was said about gossip in general and gurus in particular.
Why do I other wise know that bad karma of the one that is targeted is transfered to the gossiper and his good karma to his victim?
It is not by drinking to much coffee … haha
If I remember well mcs often stated that if one needs to speak ill of a human being restrict yourself to your mother as she deserves your good karma
Thankfully, the universe already has super-human intelligence and complete agency. Can you imagine the disaster and chaos of a universe run by human intelligence?
Not a question of Karma, but conscience and character.
When you nurse a grudge year after year, you aren’t worrying about karma.
When you pay someone every month who is killing 700,000 destitute and sick children by stopping their medication and food, you left any thought of Karma far behind years ago.
But sadly conscience and character were also thrown out, like a package deal.
Mcs told us time and again to use the knowledge of karma for our own actions to the complete exclusion of everybody else
Asked if a one satsangi had to correct another even ones friend he said … only … if it is not putting the other on a psychological defense mode as that would be detrimental to his pleasure walking the path.
When I brought something up with regard to my late partner’s meditation … with rather stern voice told me … do not push her etc etc
That’s good advice, Um for anyone outside this here Grudge Club. . How has it worked out?
Master also said, “why confront anyone? Does anyone think they aren’t right? It’s alright if there is one fool under a roof. Don’t make it two.”
But here in Church of The Churlish I’d say we got ourselves a dozen. And I’m making it a baker’s dozen!
I never brought it up again …. she was actuality the only one I ever addressed unasked with regard to matters of sant mat …and it was not even to correct or advice her … I just thought her meditation together with me at the same time would be of benefit … not together … just routine wise.
Meditation is a very personal thing. She shouldn’t have taken any offense.
However, I think I understand the defensiveness she demonstrated. Meditation itself is natural, but the discipline of sitting can become impossible. It’s a mind thing. No one can be pressed. Can a flower be pressed to grow? That never helps.
I have found it is very easy to point out other’s flaws when we don’t actually know them at all. Which explains the Church if the Churchless about 65% of the time. Brian Ji is a funny, reasonable intellect. But in any mention of RSSB, including Anon’s essays, the discussion can become cruel.
So I stay for the other stuff, like Ai, or research on meditation practice, physics, psychology, etc. Those are fun things.
This isn’t an anti-RSSB website. It always was supposed to be about a pro-human development website in all its forms, including those who engage in spiritual meditation of any kind, or mindfulness, or just simple acts of kindness. People can love these things without being able to tolerate the organizations that promote them. But the point is what they love, not the flawed organization. The two are unrelated, often.
The way to leave a bad experience behind is just to put your mind on the present and enjoy it.
Grinding away at a grudge steals from that. If someone had a hard time with any organization, why let it steal from you twice by looking back? Or a thousand times by looking back for years?
That is my entire point. No one needs to defend RSSB, and I’m not qualified and thankfully don’t carry that burden. But neither does the Master. They are too busy in the present trying to help.
There is a very large world of philosophy, science and spirituality outside of, RSSB. When Brian Ji keeps bringing up his RSSB part it is too legitimize complaint.
But Brian Ji was never just an initiate. He had always been a died in the wool rational thinker, a great advocate for Atheism.
I just prefer a more affirmational, aspirational Atheism.
She did not feel offended, I brought it up in an lengthy conversation with mgs.
I do not care at all what worldview others have … what matters is what they do with it here … use it as a conversation tool.
Nor the love or hate others have does have any meaning or value for me … it is all for them to digest the fruits of it … what matters is how they USE it in the interaction with others ….
I do not care others hate but I do not want to consume their spit on my plate when they raise their voices
So… we got active RSSB members, seeking out an openly ex-RSSB website by their own choice knowing exactly what it is, then getting mad and angry at the content which is not in favour of RSSB, which they knew they’d find here, then attacking the writers who left long ago, and continuing to do this repeatedly daily, declaring the writers are the ones with a “grudge”
Mentally ill behaviour.
If Gurinder raped your daughter would you make her have the baby?
Well,…. it has always been our understanding that the mother should give birth if possible …and the baby if need be raised by another member of the family.
Why … well based on the experience of my late partner working in an abortion clinic.
but not … made to .. by anybody.
Abortion, leaves deep psychological scars and if they can be prevented it should be done.
And … I do not care what others believe etc … my reactions have noting to do with it … but most will think otherwise.
If I do advise a person not to leave sant mat it is just an psychological issue … if a person does so without seeking justification for such a decision outside him or herself … I will never say anything.
If however a person does so using outside matters as justification … I do try to make them understand that such a decision in the long run us detrimental psychological … it has nothing to do with any justification of the clergy of santmat etc .. nothing at all
Association with a practice is in the first place, mental …psychological
What I write here is about those that write and read here … their behavior…and.. nothing else
Hi Um
Me too. I see the grudge, I see it holding people back. But I’m not sure if that is back from RSSB. Or from whatever is their natural next step.
No one can honestly know what that is except that person. But grudges, the past, keeps us from seeing what that is clearly.
Can we try to stick with something? Sure. But that might not be our destiny.
The mystic who brought me to the path explained it beautifully. On the path, no one is going backwards, or in circles. We are always moving forward. But it can appear to anyone else as if they are moving in the exact opposite direction. Tommy said, “Spence, it’s a spiral. They are moving up even when it looks like they aren’t. We don’t know what we must go through, but it is sacred no matter how it looks. It’s a spiral path.”
All are entitled to their grudges … what matters how they deal with them in the public domain and what they have to say about the causes.
Anyway
See, spiritual perspectives, volume one, page 147 and in particular the continuation of the answer on 148 by mcs …question 186
Against this fundamental dogma of the narrative as taught by the late mcs … it is all in the hans of the master… it becomes meaningless to raise ones voice towards others
What I think and feel is not at stake … people should know their narratives …both which they love and hate
There is this very, very passive approach to stating a negative judgment upon others,that, I think its traditional, where a person shares what they believe are teachings with others as a response to what others have written or said, as if such commentary had nothing whatsoever to do with the person who offers the advice, as if they were just a vehicle to passively transport teachings of the Saints to others without personal involvement.
But I have learned that a great deal of harm takes place by pretending to be passive, which would be zero participation, while actively placing advice, even citing a reference, even page numbers, for that advice.
It isn’t a real dialogue between two people.
The individual claiming to be passive isn’t. They made a personal choice to comment by refusing to take responsibility for that choice. They are electing to start out while placing their negative judgment at others.
They cannot be wrong in their own eyes because they aren’t active. It is just the individual they direct their comment to and the scripture they are citing.
It appears as an effort to be impersonal, but it is just passive agressive, becuse in all events the advice is given in contrast, as an indictment. It isn’t particularity honest.
When we have dialogue, real dialogue, both parties must take full responsibility for their choices, even choice of scripture, their words no matter who they are quoting. They chose to use those words at that moment, and are only hiding behind the skirts of their reference.
When you agree, agree whole heartedly. That’s just you.
And when your disagree, own your I opinion and accept the consequences for it.
So I believe. No hiding. No one way communication.
If I really want to take myself out of it I don’t comment. If I comment that’s my decision for all the good and flawed reasons that makes me me.
Same with you. Give help when asked. Otherwise, own your opinion as your own.
Maybe not all people are entitled to their grudges, especially when they are aimed at someone else.
Maybe no one is entitled to waste one second on a grudge.
A problem is different. It needs a solution. Everyone can help with that.
Then it’s just about you, and when you are safe and free, then you take up your next step and enjoy that freedom, rather than burden another soul who is also going through their own destiny.
But complaining about anyone, without any effort to reconcile or effort to make a real transition beyond, any personal effort at change is just placing on someone else your own work. And that is surrendering to stagnation.
Pick your lane, reconcile or go forward.
No, no one is entitled to carry a grudge. It’s baggage and harms yourself and others.
All can make up their own mind.
You will never know however whether the meaning and value you attribute to what others write is what they have in mind.
Art experts often know better what the artist drives that the artist himself … that too is all right as they are the consumers of their own thoughts
Life is a bridge not a destination. Don’t build your house here. Don’t build your fortress and your army of weapons, you treasures and luxuries here. Don’t declare war on your neighbors here when you yourself will be forfeiting all your own lands and family and treasures soon enough.
They will be an obsolete waste of time before you know it. At your “last moments”..
Keep moving and travel light.
The icky way to know what others mean is to listen better.
Mr, tepper
This is a public domain….you have always the last word and nobody is able to stand in your eloquent command of language …. yet … there are other things that matter and not in your hand.
You defend what is near and dear to you but you cannot own it
Um
I hear what you are saying.
Your words are well taken as far as they go.
They would go further as part of a dialogue.
The only way to know what others mean is to take the time to listen better.
The best way to quickly end a dialogue you don’t like?
It is to acknowledge the truth of what the other person has said.
Then they don’t have to argue for that same view over and over.
You don’t have to agree. Acknowledge.
Without that acknowledgement there isn’t a first word or last word. There is just individual commentary.
Hahaha . . Have some coffee … maybe it will unplug your ears. … add some suggar
Um
I only put sugar in my ears for special people.
But ok, for you anything.
Before I did put the book back were it belongs, spiritual perspective, volume 1, I opened the book and read the answer to question 479
You see it was the tone Mr tepper, the tone of invitation
Hi Um
Question 479
Does everyone get the same amount of grace?
As Maharaji writes, it looks different for different people. That’s why we can’t judge. And that’s why holding a grudge makes no sense. We don’t actually know.
And this also supports what Tommy said, that on the path you are always moving forward, but it can look absolutely the opposite to anyone else… It’s a spiral moving upwards, but often looking like we are going backwards.
So do we get the same amount of Grace? We get all there is, we get all we can handle, because the Master is managing all that.
And when we can handle the hills, then we get a vertical climb.
For whatever you like or don’t like about management, he is management.
Be happy you don’t have to see it. As Baba Ji said in Petaluma, ‘be happy you don’t work for me.’
We, my friend an I worked for him, he shook hands with us, and and thanked us … the rest his history … friend left this world and I went on.
It is always good to leave things behind with good feelings, certainly when they were so near and dear.
That does not leave room for grudges Mr tepper.
I’m with you Um.
I think I get your point.
You may have grown past something that promised to be everything.
But you leave with great respect and kind feelings for all that you did receive. No grudges.
It served a very powerful purpose for you, contributed to who you are today, but you have set reasonable expectations on your own. You didn’t swallow the common myths.
That is an internal locus of control, BTW.
A lot of research into why Hitler could control so many people originally revealed this dynamic.
“The “Obedience to Authority” Experiment (Stanley Milgram, 1961); Stanley Milgram’s famous study.The Setup: Everyday participants were told by a researcher in a lab coat to administer increasingly severe (but fake) electric shocks to a stranger in another room whenever that stranger answered a question wrong.The Result: A shocking 65% of participants went all the way to the maximum, potentially fatal 450-volt level, simply because an authority figure told them to.How it relates to Locus of Control:Subsequent psychologists (like Holland in 1967) re-examined Milgram’s work to see what kind of personality traits allowed the remaining 35% of people to defy the orders and refuse to shock the stranger.External Locus: Participants who went all the way to 450 volts often blamed the researcher, saying things like, “He made me do it,” or “I was just following orders.” They passed the moral responsibility to an external force.Internal Locus: Conversely, participants with a high internal locus of control were significantly more likely to rebel against the researcher. Because they believed they were ultimately responsible for their own actions and outcomes, they refused to violate their ethics, standing up to the authority figure.”
To blame authority for one’s own personal responsibilities reflects an external locus of control. But it is the mainstream.
In this case those who don’t expect anything and stand on their own two feet function quite well in Sant Mat, while those who need to relinquish personal responsibility have a hard time staying. Unless, like you, they leave of their own volition and never harbored the sort of dependency that had left others with anger and a grudge.
Conversely, you left with great love for the Master, even after you made a different personal decision.
Perhaps there will be a day
when AI initiate people into sant mat
Quite possible
How can be it?
Can Future AI will be able to Love?
upon which core sant mat is based
Ai already is because of the fakeness and unworthiness of the guru and the disciple. It will take the place of the King James version of the Path. ( With pretty pictures of inner regions 3d). Some might think that’s great. I think it’s sickening and it’s sickening already what’s already happening. They forgot about love , even the master has. The true masters will be banned. It’s already happening. It can’t love but it can influence and to most people that’s better.
I saw this morning that Trump wants to relabel AI as SI. He explained that the word “artificial” makes the technology “sound fake,” arguing that the tools are actually “amazing” and that “super intelligence” is a much more accurate term. He’s wrong as usual. The term AI. refers to being made or produced by human beings rather than occurring naturally, especially as a copy of something natural.
I’m happy that whether the world/universe is run by humans or eventually AI, nature will always (as it always has) adapt and evolve. Even if the Earth is completely destroyed, the elements it is comprised of will endure – nothing in nature is lost. I would be sad, though, at the loss of the countless innocent life forms that nature has produced over millions of years. But after saying that, nature is also the various chemical and mineral elements that make up the earth – and the universe.
I see no evidence of God or gods controlling man and the universe. Such is a poor concept when compared to the sublimity of nature. And as for Karma – originally meant simply “action” or “deed,” functioning as a natural law of cause and effect rather than a system of cosmic payback – a concept that has been hijacked by the various gurus, mystics and masters to give hope and purpose to adherents.
And, in a sense, that is quite natural, as many generally gravitate toward some utopia, some hoped-for divine intervention that will give us a sense of grand meaning and purpose. That sadly does not exist in nature – apart from nature’s unconscious drive to survive and adapt.
In our language we have a two pard word
One part means giving and the other part, the prefrx, is what is given.
I am reading a book of an academic on the crisis of the process of giving = attributing, meaning and value.
The prefix he uses is “zin” …has 8 different meanings …. sense , liking, mood, mind etc
Being raised in a conservative protestant environment everything humans do feel and think can be put in Frame … a very organized way of life…people on their way towards something…purpose.
Het starts out with saying that “zin-geving” = attributing meaning and value to everything we do, think and feel in life has purpose and direction.
Than he states that this attribution or this having a narrative as I call it, is as necessary as eating and drinking
That lack causes society being in turmoil or as I call it it .. disturbed ant nest chaos.
I do not know whether he is right 1. It might me right for most but not all … one might be able to transcend that need.
So … people do not know anymore what to devote, spend their live energy to. … just finding pleasure in going somewhere,
They grow up, study, learn a profession work, have children … without having the slightest idea where it is all good for, were and what it fits in.
What remains is the intoxication of something … tiktok
Who can stand the here and now?!
Words are often misunderstood and not even completely felt by the user. So whether or not there’s any retribution for calling your ceiling another man’s floor if you live in an apartment depends on what people really think and feel. The Beatles had a negative experience with the Maharishi but George went on to say that he still did them and the world some good. And I’d rather see people with rssb at a meeting than on the streets trying to score fentanyl. At least they claim to be vegetarian. So it does the world good even if it’s not what it says it is or what it claims to be. And for Gurinder the businessman steeped in growth , that’s progress. Real Masters know that it’s the quality not the quantity that counts. Ai is great fantastic but not for spiritual use. Eventually you have to leave your super intelligence behind to find spirituality
People saying that those who left will face bad karma punishment after death or in future lives are just screaming into the void. As if that would make anybody return to RSSB for real. Fear doesn’t work and should not be used within RSSB. At this point it’s just spiritual bullying. Who are these people to declare divine punishment over others? Like they themselves are a guru? The ego is so unreal. Imagine the bad karma they get slandering and judging others in this way. I am RSSB and would never judge anyone who left RSSB. RSSB even says to only speak with love, “pyar di naal samajhao” is what guru says. These people are not real RSSB if they threaten you with spiritual consequences. They are just spiritual bullies. Not true peace seekers in this world.
Spence,
I do wonder if this “Tommy” might be an imaginary friend of yours, or did he really exist?
Sometimes I also wonder if you’re just trolling everyone on this blog with all your spam psuedo sentimental messages, or just always wanting to have the last word.
Psychologists might pin point to a childhood of neglect during formative school years.
There’s no hurt, grudge, or even shame in it. As for me, I got my own psychiatric concerns.
Hi Tej
I understand your doubts. Yes Tommy was the mystic who brought me to the path.
You may watch a memorial video his wife, Maria and I made when my beloved friend passed away.
https://youtu.be/mjpH0NRa1D0?si=q8BxtvV6nZHLLu2O
I was fortunate to know Tommy. I gave him quite a hard time. We argued about the necessity of a human being as Master for nearly two years.
Then, something happened. I was reading Sawan Singh’s Volume III of Philosophy of the Masters, the volume on Love, and I was pulled up quite abruptly into the stars, into showers of multicolored stars, through an exploding sun, and pulled at speeds across regions of darkness and then into light that was pure terror, in that moment. Like being shot out of a cannon. And when it ended all I could do was smile. I was shown directly everything I had read about. And it reminded me of similar incidents in childhood. My only interest in the path was to find answers to what I had been through as a child and young adult. Here I was handed the answer not by explanation, but by a quick trip past the stars and the regions.
So, that ended any argument I could ever have invented.
Your attempt to psychoanalyze and your accusations towards my own honesty is just another form of blame and grudge, but that’s what Church of the Churlish is about these days. It seems to bother you that someone doesn’t agree with you. But I find it refreshing. I don’t mind people who disagree. I do mind an echo chamber of people stroking each other’s ego. So I don’t mind even the complaints, until they become static. Until the complainer has no personal interest in learning more about themselves. Until the grudge becomes more important than the person holding it.
Whatever helps bring you to the place where you see all people as your equals, maybe even your betters, that’s the place to go. And sometimes it does mean acknowledging harsh treatment, a tough experience, a difficult history. But acknowledging all that honestly is just a step to resolving, to becoming whole and moving forward. Not a ditch to make your home or drag others into.
“I don’t like that man, I need to get to know him better.”
Abraham Lincoln
Lincoln was a genius at dissolving polarized thinking. And he always started with himself.
I do suggest it is not a good use of your time to be so polarized. Grudges only have a positive use if you stop to ask yourself why you are reacting this way.
As for all those with psychological issues that you see when you read these comments, that is also very understandable. When Brian Ji doubles down on his grudges and year after year continues to hold his polarized view, to blame and denigrate the master, seeking evidence to support his grudge, there must be some personal utility to it: he creates a polarity that naturally draws two extremes: those who agree, who also hold a grudge, and those who do not but who are deeply interested in the subject of Sant Mat from any view point.
There are people here who were never initiates and now hate RSSB solely on the basis of what Brian Ji, Anon and others have written. Not on the basis of their own direct experience as seekers or initiates.
I suggest that if you look back at your own comments, you will see the level of accusations you make to those with whom you disagree. That reflects the level of polarity and dualistic thinking. But it’s not an issue. Just open your mind, find some peace. We are all changing our minds every day. It’s called learning and growth.
I make so many mistakes every day, Tej. What sort of life could I have if I couldn’t acknowledge, learn and move on?
Try to understand that you and I, that Master and you, are in fact very, very similar. We are all souls and these personalities are just very flimsy and temporary covers. No point in having any reaction.
Love is probably the only emotion worth having, and hopefully you can understand why people who love the Master would say so. Hate, however is very costly. I have no idea why anyone would hold a grudge for decades. Every day that steals something from you. Even if you and Brian were factually correct, why go back there over and over and over again? Why identify with that grudge? Why let it steal your happiness and your attention?
You think I and those defending the Master are the problem. But no, we are not the problem, Tej. And you are no problem for me. My problems and issues are of my own making and my own responsibility, just as yours.
But I do have a friend, my Master. Whatever has happened, or will happen, however wonderful or however terrible, I am not for one half second alone.
If you love the Master, that is worth your time. But if you hate him, for your own reasons, maybe even valid ones, then once you have made your choice, why go back there? You are letting the very thing you hate steal from you over and over again?
That is a question only you can answer.
But there is no harm in my bringing it up.
Spence,
Do accept my apologies, as I watched part of the video so far and realized that Tommy did actually indeed exist. He looks like a legend!
As for your intimate and personal experiences, I appreciate that you share them here with me.
But, I feel it is no use for you to share them so publicly to an audience that cannot and will not be able to appreciate and relate to supernatural phenomena and experiences beyond ordinary senses.
Regarding, grudges, I still can’t quite get a grasp about what you mean, as I simply see Anon sharing his personal limited views, but truthful perspective of his experiences with RSSB. Yes, Brian has an opinion. But so do the rest of us. Certainly, an opinion doesn’t necessarily equate to a grudge.
Of course, there are hate speech in the words of some extreme negative commenters towards RSSB and Baba-Ji, but why let it bother you? (It is their Karma and relationship with him.)
Anyway, I know I was hard on you with some of my comments. But I sincerely wanted you to see what you were doing. You are sharing deeply personal intimate experiences to an audience that doesn’t value it. And, you do tend to get annoyingly preachy in my opinion.
Anyway, if you think this the way forward for you, I am nobody to try and shake or wake you out of it. But I do feel, you are fighting a losing battle.
Anyway, my sincere apologies for any hurtful remarks that I may have made towards you. Hope you find your peace 🕊️
Thank you Tej
Yes, you are right.
It is past due for me to give this a rest.
Honey works much better on me than vinegar.
Hi Tej:
A couple of thoughts. I don’t think it makes sense to tell anyone they are wrong. It’s a thankless job, unless one does have a grudge. Then, for that individual it becomes part of their identity.
What is the difference between an honest observation and a grudge?
First, when that observation becomes the start of a chain of personal responsibility and change, so that the source of the complaint becomes less and less important for oneself, until it entirely disappears and never clouds one’s own mental real estate. That’s an honest observation with a positive purpose.
That is a person who never refers to it, certainly not publicly. And certainly not in thousands of posts over nearly two decades.
That is actually a grudge. Now a grudge can certainly have a grain of truth to it. Most absolutely do.
But once you are safe and can pursue your life apart from that grudge, then to go back to it again and again, and publicly is to nail yourself to the source of the grudge. And because it is public, it leaves no room for you to also publicly change your mind. That happens when we look back years later, having made substantial personal progress, and realize the part we played in creating our own havoc. A stove may indeed be hot and burn, but we learn at some point that placing our hand upon it is 100% our responsibility, and the stove had no intention or even agency as regard to our personal experience.
So, why do I persist? It isn’t rational. But neither is a grudge. For a grudge steals a part of you. Once is bad enough, but returning to it, the grudge becomes a swindler. You happily give it your entire identity and left a pauper.
What looks to you like just an observation, over time and repeated pounding, is just a grudge. Because the grudge has taken on a life of its own. So people can’t get away from it. The grudge has stolen their life. The problem is still the same. To separate from it, to leave it off.
All the advice you have given to me, asking what purpose my comments her could possibly have, and how that may even be harmful to me most certainly applies to those who continue to persist in their grudge.
So, do I have a grudge too?
What other reason could someone have to persistently point to something higher, and better? How can that be a grudge?
That is the effect of love. Love persists, and love is stronger than any grudge. For Love we do all sorts of strange things that others see no reason in at all. How could they understand?
If you love your Master, if you love anyone more than yourself, then you understand completely, and you reserve questioning for yourself. You might refrain from accusing others of having mental health issues. That isn’t innaccurate, but it most certainly applies to everyone here who either can’t let go their grudge, or their love.
For me, I would think love is stronger and much healthier. But hey, that’s just my situation.
Still, as I did before, I invite you to join that simple agreement that love is better than hate, that we are really all brothers and sisters, and that negative situations only serve a purpose for us to overcome them, to move past them into positive experiences and never let them take hold. Rather, let love take hold.
And love will pull you through anything, Tej, even your own shortcomings, even your own weaknesses, as it does every single day for me.
Hi Brian,
I have been reading your blogs and the comments they garner for quite a while.
But I can’t help and notice that your blog seems to get the attention of the misfits, the outcastes, and the crazies. I for one, am a misfit and an outcaste by my own standards.
But judging from the comments and participants, I feel there are a lot more coo coo heads than me on this site. (Not to seem too saner than thou, by any means)
But doesn’t it make you wonder, who are the majority of your audience or participants?
Once in a while, you do get a thoughtful or meaningful feedback and input. But most of the comments are all just gibberish rubbish.
Doesn’t it make you wonder?
It’s like an asylum in here!
Tej, I agree with you. Keep in mind that most people don’t comment on internet news stories, blog posts, and such. Only some do. So they aren’t representative of this blog’s readership.
Tej, get your hands on the english translation of the writer , nescio… translated by daniel sponger titled: the amsterdam stories.
Sit, read, have coffee …enjoy the life of the losers nogoods
Sorry … translator is Damion searls
You mean people actually read the comments ? What about the Comix. Did anyone remember Gurinder as Mr Natural in ZAP comic books ? One again, once you are initiated there’s no turning back , no exes. You’re still tapped into that inner silver cord, maybe for the next life. The next life doesn’t necessarily have to be physical on earth. But I recommend not getting initiated unless you know the story of Dracula.
https://youtu.be/_-3XMb99MII?is=TIMvO6asUlXpbz_O