Below is another in a series of guest blog posts from Anon, an ex-RSSB initiate. RSSB stands for Radha Soami Satsang Beas, an India-based religious organization headed up by a guru that I belonged to for 35 years, which explains my interest in sharing criticisms of the faith that I also found lacking.
Anon makes a point at the end of his post that I’ve thought about also. RSSB does seem to be a declining religion, because young people aren’t attracted to it.
Kind of a tough sell when the “marketing” is no sex outside of marriage, strict vegetarian diet, no alcohol, no recreational drugs, 2.5 hours of meditation a day, need to go to church/satsang every week, regular volunteer work for RSSB strongly encouraged. Other than that, have fun, kids!
RSSB AND CHILDREN
RSSB frequently says that it does not force people to raise their children RSSB. You may often have heard the guru benevolently saying something like
“Do not force children brother/sister”
“Forcefully bringing people is not the way”
“They will resent it and go against it later”
“We must just be a good example to them”
“When they see we are a good RSSB example, they will follow naturally” etc
The reality is, RSSB does not really encourage this “natural following”.
RSSB has dedicated children’s creches, areas and tents specifically for children. They have a happy atmosphere with toys and other kids. However it is not a child-free environment. There is a space for children at RSSB. In the children’s area there is satsang being played.
There are also children specific RSSB books. These are clearly designed for children to read. From a young age RSSB has dedicated literature for parents to give to their kids. The indoctrination does begin young. These are not aimed at teenagers or young adults but at primary school children and younger. It’s really unlikely a child is going to say “mom, dad, I want to know more about radha soami satsang beas spiritual teachings”. This is clearly for parents to share with their child, or impose/indoctrinate.
RSSB also says while they encourage someone to follow their lifestyle rules, these do not have to be imposed on children. In reality, RSSB teaching emphasises strongly that this is the true path and these requirements are needed in order to achieve salvation and guru’s grace – who is framed as God In Human Form. In practical reality, most households do have these lifestyle laws built in and children of RSSB followers are often raised with the lifestyle requirements.
I saw many children often being brought along to satsangs when they were “old enough” – namely crossing over the age limits after the children’s areas and graduating to the main halls. You do see young people e.g. teenagers there. They have clearly been brought there by parents and do not have the independence to make their own decisions.
By the time the child is a young adult – they have had a lifestyle of RSSB rules and satsangs and junior literature – they are almost primed for it.
This does mean that by the time the child is no longer a child – you’ve got a ready made RSSB follower. Right?
At Dera there’s schools and education and kids are raised IN the environment. This doesn’t really sound like “don’t force your kids”.
REALITY CHECK
The reality is in 2026 onwards – the next level of disciples are Milennials, Gen Z, Gen A and onwards. The current old gen followers are the last of their generation and cannot frame a failure to adopt the teachings as “failure to comply”.
In my time there, I saw a handful of young adults as regulars but mainly only those who were the kids of key sevadars and were indoctrinated young – but not all. Many had children (teenager or young adult or grown adult) who simply didn’t engage. I saw very few. (I cannot speak for India – being the RSSB region of origin, the birthplace of the ‘guru’ concept and the ethnic homeland of all the past and present gurus).
WHY?
Who knows. You’ll have to ask them.
But the reality is: what I’ve always said – while the guruship is inherited, discipleship isn’t. The reality is the next generations of followers don’t really want to be doing this.
I asked quite a few and honestly?
They never said why. They just dipped.
While some ex initiates like myself, Brian and others may speak about their experiences. Younger generations aren’t even doing that. They’re just gone.
Criticise all you like – at least RSSB is getting feedback from us. The next gen are just a wall of silence if they’re out. This is the generation that watches a 5 second clip and scrolls. I don’t think they’ll do 2.5 hours of meditation daily for years to “see what happens”. RSSB is delusion if it thinks it’ll work for them. Demonising the internet isn’t going to work on them either.
Good luck out there.
Anon.
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I think in this particular instance, it is the responsibility of the parent to not even suggest that their kids become initiates. The creches erc. have been there for decades as a place to leave their kids safely when they attend satsang, do seva or whatever. If a child is inclined to seeking out spiritual matters, they will do their own investigations irrespective and importantly, should be allowed to do so. Personally, spirituality fascinated me from very, very young. My folks were not initiated then, but they’d sit and discuss spirituality across a variety of traditions. I arrived at my own conclusions. By the age of 16 (parents were still not initiates yet) I’d delved into many Eastern spiritual perspectives which felt right for me personally – or they resonated for me. When RSSB came along, the teachings of Great Master in particular felt entirely familiar. I eventually sought initiation at 27 and back then, the approach of the sangat was to never encourage initiation – you had to be sure. When I visited Dera for the first time, it felt like somewhere I knew very well. The old Satsangar in particular. I had odd flashbacks that to me, idicated I had indeed been there before. Great Master has always resonated with me strongly, not Charan Singh, and I still believe that those more original teachings are not of the mark. My beef is with the current dispensation. I feel a profound inner sadness about what RSSB is today, combined with a level of disgust that this pathnhas been so horribly skewed and screwed by the so called guru/s now. My intuition tells me that RSSB is no longer focused on true spirituality. It has become a religion. One can comfortably leave a specific path or never go with it in the first place – thats an individual decision. One thing GSD did say many years ago, is that RSSB is not the only path – there are numerous true Masters on the planet at any given time, and to think that RSSB is the only true path, is entirely arrogant. I have ditched my association with RSSB because it has become a religion and lacks the substance it once had. I am also diabolocally opposed to the actions of the current dispensation. Personally, I sought initiation for purely spiritual reasons and I have come across a path that is devoid entirely of the religious aspect that I am not comfortable with. That said, mentally, I am still on a spiritual sabbatical in a sense, after devoting an enormous amount of time to RSSB in both meditation and seva. There came a point where what I intuitively felt was right, I began to question. My warning siren started to blare internally which I only later discovered to have aligned almost exactly with when GSD veered off the path himself, evidenced by his actions and dealings. But that is my story and experience. Each has their own. That kids today are not all enthralled by this path in particular is hardly surprising. There are others out there, and of your motivation is towards spirituality and maturing in it at a soul level, RSSB is highly unlikely to be attractive. Its sad, but it is what it is. A good parent will never indoctrinate their kids. A good truly spiritually inclined parent with truly spiritual inentions, will allow their kids to make their own decisions. I’ve read those books. They don’t indoctrinate kids. They simply explain spiritual matters in simplistic terms. Thats fine. A kid who already has an understanding carried over from previous births will know whether those stories are accurate enough or not anyway. Pushing a kid into something will eventually have them rebel, or they will see that RSSB now is a load of crap and seek elsewhere. That all boils down to the individual and that individuals intentions.
Amen. You said it all. No grudge sensed , just good ol common sense! Thanks
How many Gods in human form will it take before you and I realize that we’ve been scammed by GSD ? I personally don’t feel like Maharaji was even capable of scamming but I’m not the final judge on these matters. Karma is. I feel like GSD was telling the truth when he said in public on stage that he could be the biggest criminal on the planet. They both look guilty of something sitting up there. Guilt is written all over their faces , disguised as benevolence. Einstein disguised as Robin Hood.
Thanks Ronald!
The path that I’ve stumbled upon – I had a very long chat to one of the people there. He explained that living Masters can and sometimes do veer off their path and choose worldy ambitions over their spiritual duties. So GSD is likely one of those. I never met Huzur as GSD was in the seat when I came across RSSB – in the early days of him at the helm. Having done an enormous amount of research before coming across RSSB, a similar spiritual practice exists across nearly every religion. But they have become religions and the essence of the foundational teachings and practice has been lost over time. So what Great Master and those before him taught, was not off the mark. What RSSB is today and will continue to become, is a religion that progressively disolves the actual essence of the original teachings. Religions have their place, but if one inwardly feels that feeling of “there is more to this” – religion no longer satisfies the need to evolve. We all have had our own spiritual evolution, but for me personally, RSSB no longer aligns with the morals and substance that initially were related to this path. People have said that when this new ‘master’ walks in, he is so charismatic. Yes, so was Hitler. Being charismatic does not equal substance and moral standing. For those who continue to follow RSSB and bow to those figureheads – thats where they are, that works for them, and they’re welcome to it. When I decided to sever my ties with RSSB, I did so knowing that very likely, the creator, God – however you want to put it, will know my intentions. In time, when the time is right, for me – I’ll continue my spiritual journey. That matters far more than sticking around in something that one disagrees with oit of fear of being sent to all hell and damnation. Better to be honest than to keep up appearances for others.
I’m with you on all that. I felt a special connection to the Great Master myself. An uncanny resemblance to start with but his books said it all . But that was then and this is now. I’m not afraid of damnation but I appreciate the warning from everyone concerned. It’s too bad it wasn’t inner temptations that lured GSD away from the path it was just plain old worldly stuff that did it. I’ll stick with the inner temptations myself because he doesn’t affect my meditation or my peace of mind anymore. And really that’s how he wants it. He’s ( GSD )all retired now. We won’t even have to see him at the time of death.lol Gurinder cleared that up in some of the questioning too. He ain’t coming.
I think in this particular instance, it is the responsibility of the parent to not even suggest that their kids become initiates. The creches erc. have been there for decades as a place to leave their kids safely when they attend satsang, do seva or whatever. If a child is inclined to seeking out spiritual matters, they will do their own investigations irrespective and importantly, should be allowed to do so. Personally, spirituality fascinated me from very, very young. My folks were not initiated then, but they’d sit and discuss spirituality across a variety of traditions. I arrived at my own conclusions. By the age of 16 (parents were still not initiates yet) I’d delved into many Eastern spiritual perspectives which felt right for me personally – or they resonated for me. When RSSB came along, the teachings of Great Master in particular felt entirely familiar. I eventually sought initiation at 27 and back then, the approach of the sangat was to never encourage initiation – you had to be sure. When I visited Dera for the first time, it felt like somewhere I knew very well. The old Satsangar in particular. I had odd flashbacks that to me, indicated I had indeed been there before. Great Master has always resonated with me strongly, not Charan Singh, and I still believe that those more original teachings are not of the mark. My beef is with the current dispensation. I feel a profound inner sadness about what RSSB is today, combined with a level of disgust that this pathnhas been so horribly skewed and screwed by the so called guru/s now. My intuition tells me that RSSB is no longer focused on true spirituality. It has become a religion. One can comfortably leave a specific path or never go with it in the first place – thats an individual decision. One thing GSD did say many years ago, is that RSSB is not the only path – there are numerous true Masters on the planet at any given time, and to think that RSSB is the only true path, is entirely arrogant. I have ditched my association with RSSB because it has become a religion and lacks the substance it once had. I am also diabolocally opposed to the actions of the current dispensation. Personally, I sought initiation for purely spiritual reasons and I have come across a path that is devoid entirely of the religious aspect that I am not comfortable with. That said, mentally, I am still on a spiritual sabbatical in a sense, after devoting an enormous amount of time to RSSB in both meditation and seva. There came a point where what I intuitively felt was right, I began to question. My warning siren started to blare internally which I only later discovered to have aligned almost exactly with when GSD veered off the path himself, evidenced by his actions and dealings. But that is my story and experience. Each has their own. That kids today are not all enthralled by this path in particular is hardly surprising. There are others out there, and of your motivation is towards spirituality and maturing in it at a soul level, RSSB is highly unlikely to be attractive. Its sad, but it is what it is. A good parent will never indoctrinate their kids. A good truly spiritually inclined parent with truly spiritual inentions, will allow their kids to make their own decisions. I’ve read those books. They don’t indoctrinate kids. They simply explain spiritual matters in simplistic terms. Thats fine. A kid who already has an understanding carried over from previous births will know whether those stories are accurate enough or not anyway. Pushing a kid into something will eventually have them rebel, or they will see that RSSB now is a load of crap and seek elsewhere. That all boils down to the individual and that individuals intentions.
Interventions before the age of 15 for boys and 13 for girls is red flag
This is the age curiosity fully blooms
and they want to explore the world on their own
RSSB kills that passion
The world is changing.
What has served humanity for ages and decades, for better or worse, has lost its meaning and value, on all fields of human endeavors.
Does anybody think rssb, religion, spirituality could escape?!
In my book we are in the autumn of culture and the trees of society and culture are losing their leaves and winter is at hand.
we see the raise of movements to preserve what …WAS….and … the raise of crime for that reason and the unability of the government to stop it.
Parents have lost their power to raise their children to participate in the walk of humanity.
Do not focus on rssb, that is old style globalized your view, wake up in the world and observe.
See how a growing number of nations is ruled…if you think it only happens in Jamaica, or in South America were organized gangs rule by fear …cooking their victims …then you are blind
To show my good-natured ness and willingness to share I’m going to comment instead of meditating this morning. Um is correct. The blue meanies are winning the world to their side and the sway is so much that they’re just meanies now, no color. GSD chose his successor(s) and now Gill is finally recognized as having as much sway as GSD at the Dera. Maybe not so much other places but Gurinder earned the moniker ” the no caring guru” and the same might be said of his nephew ( by marriage). What he said to me might be more like blasphemy or heresy . So if it is blasphemy that I’m to be a recognized master of santmat then it’s Gurinder’s blasphemy that I believe and repeat. I was writing letters and received letters to the USA from Charan Singh when I was too young according to the rules to officially be initiated but just by communicating with him I had unofficially become initiated. Plus how odd would it be for God to allow initiation from someone who I myself initiated in my previous life. My own grandson in my previous life was the best choice for the job. My questioning GSD about his choices for successor began with me so I have no problem questioning Gil either. I don’t know why he would single me out for this particular pain and not tell the rest of the world unless he was some type of weirdo like people say. I’m going to wait till his dying day to disbelieve him completely, or to dive in head first and spread the good news and joy upon his death . It’s just like changing cars going from one body to the next during the afterlife transition. Yeah these kids I’ve always been told should live life first before they seek a solitary journey. I knew this all was going to happen because Gurinder does not have very much insight on human nature and now they’re choosing one guru over the other there at Dera. And that’s just human nature. I don’t know what the hell he expected else except maybe him going to jail for his crimes. It’s because of all my experiences of inner and outer that I do believe that I’m America’s first and finest.
I do believe the people who claim that people’s perspectives and comments are formed by their uniquely individual experiences and so I forgive them in advance for what they’re about to say. That seems to be what they want. Forgiveness. It should go without saying that I forgave Babaji in advance way way long time ago
The first and the finest ever recognized American Sant Mat guru. That’s a good story to stick to Ron !
When an Indian gentle man stood up during an q&a session in the room in the old guesthouse in dera and asked the late mcs for advise as to whether or not raise the children as satsangis he answered ( what follows is my recollection of the event !!!)
NO …DEFEFINATLY NOT!!!
Give them a good example and LET them grow
Silence….
But it is the duty of the parents, to inculcate the spiritual values of life ….and … you can do so in any capacity that suits you ….you can speak about nature, Sunday school etc
In older days parents would, depending on their social class, level of education an personal preferences, prepare their children for participation in society.
That participation was within the context of an shared concept of what that society and culture was.
Parents would share their economic, political and religious values of their family, neighborhood, village and country with their children .. all class oriented
These communities are all gone and with it are lost the concepts of who you are, what you are supposed to do etc.
People have become nobodies, uprooted from their traditions and live like ants frantically seeking for answers because their nest was disturbed by somebody with a stick.
Where and how to find purpose, direction for kids if their parents have nothing to say nothing to offer …?????….. well…they have tiktok,….
J
In order to digest knowledge one has to be trained properly. Knowledge was and is dangerous …like a knife.
Delf into the content of the media and you will soon understand what is going on in the world and what is going to come.
The ant analogy very aprapo! I thought that very same thing but when I was a kid looking at an ant bed. How they somehow reminded me of people even way back when. That’s the gods eye nature view of actual people in the world is why. And then while playing marbles one time I had the same deja vu about the planets revolving like marbles. So yeah I was kind of a cosmic kid even growing up. A barn saint . Actually on a farm.
I wonder how many people are going to be running around like chickens with their heads cut off when GSD actually passes or will they sit and meditation and wait for the comforter. ( The all pervading everlasting Shabd that runs through every soul and is the very definition of soul. )
I don’t understand why Gurinder doesn’t comment under his own name on this blog that he reads religiously if nothing else just to see what I have to say because I’m no different around him than I am around anybody else. I have communicated with Mr Gill before the great announcement of his newfound Glory. And he told me that he thinks having an American master would be great. He might be commenting here under an alias. I’m just afraid that after too much influence from his uncle he might become unwilling to share . With all the nefarious activities at Dera I just hope they have the will in a safe place
I never pushed my one biological son or my step kids into anything at all. We were served vegetarian food by my wife and I but he certainly got meat from my mother and other McDonald’s customers. So he’s not initiated and he’s not a vegetarian but he’s a good man. When I told him about Babaji telling me to grow my beard, and why , his response was something like , Well dad you’ve always been into that Path. So despite everything else children of the more solemn religious satsangis never fared much better. Gurinder told me during our hours of conversation that he loves everybody he said, not just satsangies. So whether someone is a satsangi or not is completely irrelevant. I was raised in a meat-eating Catholic environment and I became vegetarian quite young on my own and that’s the way it should be. I related to a path and a teacher halfway around the world in India because that’s where my sanskaras came from.
One thing is sure …. in Europe hardly any children from those initiated by the late mcs, have been initiated …notwithstanding their positive association in the past….and their children are not even religious or anti-religious.
Where I live one church after the other closes the doors, as well as monasteries and religious orders have no follow up and what remains is importing priests from Africa and Asia to read the mass.
What seem to flourish in small elite niches is a kind of “spa, feel good” yoga, zen and other activities …Latin mass …etc….incense, drums, chanting, ayahuasca etc. … and …NOT for free
But the seed has been sown … who knows what will come from it in 2 or 3 generations.
the practice to be found will be totally different than those from the past, and… universal …
I’ll tell you why after some investigation. It’s because Gurinder never appealed to them. And I’ve sat next to some of these older children that you’re talking about at big gatherings ( mainly in Petaluma)while their mother gazes with adoration at Babaji the children are sitting there going wtf. And I found myself explaining to them to their mother’s gratitude that I did take the time to even talk to a child.
RSSB specifically states that children are not to be indoctrinated.
However, they are to be taught good values, good ethics.
That is the duty of every parent.
In all the children’s centers or areas I’ve seen there are many activities, coloring books, stories to read and none of them are RSSB materials.
All the books are classic children’s stories and modern stories that advocate friendship, helping one another, determination, problem solving, and the power of a positive attitude and good friends to overcome adversity, the power of inclusion and diversity.
That is, I believe, by design.
Parents do have an obligation to raise their children in the best way possible. And in RSSB that is with an open mind grounded in good human values.
Spirituality is an intimate and individual inner relationship to one’s own Master. There is no mention of it in the children’s centers.
But if that relationship is one of faith then it includes faith in what the Master teaches, that the Master draws to themselves those destined for initiation, but also that the Master watches over all the initiate’s family.
It is, as far as an organizational ethic, ideal.
Sant Mat, as all true spirituality, is the path of finding our home, our real treasure, going within, through the practice of meditation.
Whereas the world advocates seeking one’s fortunes looking outward.
Not everyone is meant for a life focused on mediation, spirituality, a deep and mystical relationship to one’s Teacher and Friend.
When any young person is drawn to the path, they automatically seek to learn more about the path, and in time this leads to a desire for initiation. But this is quite a different direction than their young peers are drawn into; the whirlpool of worldly entanglements.
And therefore numbers will never be large. They will be what they are meant to be.
It is always a sacred and individual matter.
I sure hope he appoints you guru and not me! You follow that path religiously and now that it’s just another religion you’re better suited preacher. That way you can just cloister with your own. And disregard everyone else.
I think the big difference between you and I Ron, is that I know my Master is an infinitely better human being than I am, and that I gain some shred of credibility and a bit of an ethical backbone, and the courage to do the extra work of doing my job and carrying my weight entirely focused on His loving face.
I am first and foremost a student, and a student I will always be. And that’s a good thing. I don’t worry about going to the top. I am focused on the next rung of the ladder. Join me.
It’s not about you or I or anyone else but Him. But the Him I’m talking about is beyond description or judgement. You can’t form an opinion about Him. You can bathe in His love, if you like. If you are lucky enough to leave your ego at the door.
But then, opinions must be left behind.
It’s only about that next rung, and the One helping us grasp it. That’s just two, and in the better moments, just One.
No there’s no difference brother we’re all the same . I just hope that your worship of the physical form leads to your worship of the formless.
It’s ok Ron.
In the Jewish tradition men cover their heads to symbolize that God is greater. We are always under Him.
He is greater than you or I, so long as we live through our tiny minds, thinking we are great. Thinking we are not actually brothers, but that you are greater than I.
But all Satsangis are indeed the same for they have one Master who is within them.
So long as you as a separate identity believe you are the highest and greatest in all creation, we can never be brothers.
Why do the children’s areas exist?
So their parents can attend Satsang and do Seva.
Speaking from within the narrative I also believed that the master was looking after relatives of his initiates and it was a comforting belief too.
Since the narrative has lost its meaning and value, not all has gone. Due to the association I have developed some insights in humanity I did not have before …AND…could never have had.
To give an example in the conversations and correspondence I had with the late mcs many issues related to the concept of humility and meekness were discussed in such a way that these concepts lost their emptiness.
Some people are by nature humble and meek WITHOUT knowing it . If one talks with these people about these concepts they have no idea what you are talking about … like the crow and the fish in water, do not know who and where they are.
In that sense I do know some children from satsangis of the late mcs to me are born mystics so to say, without any interest or knowledge of sant mat or any other streaming …probably why ronald called his son .. a good man
Yep
The fact that Brian Ji with full knowledge and zero concern, pays every month the man who is causing the deaths of 700,000 children and as many adults is ample evidence that the welfare of children is not his concern.
This grudge is his concern, and the concern of Anon and others who indulge it.
Dear Spence, fond RS to you.
I have read you mention Musk is causing the deaths of 700,000 children several times now.
That claim was never proven.
It’s as directionally presumptive and hypothetical as people claiming that Dear Beas’ push to expand its territory further and further up has caused farmers nearby major losses (financial and emotional), or unnaturally changed the course of the river Beas which has been creating long lasting repercussions, or GSD’s brother in law, who he went to pay a visit in prison, has been killing the current and future generations of Punjab with his expansive drug racket, or that GSD has committed financial fraud though he’ll never be acquitted.
Do you mind explaining:
1. The source of your claim that Musk is causing the deaths of 700,000 children
2. How Brian Hines pays Musk every month?
He sounds jealous of Musk and of us who follow the vows explicitly and never complained. He’s an internet junkie who throws so called facts around like they were fake news. I don’t know if they get that from GSD but even GSD doesn’t judge that harshly. Just ask his brother-in-law in prison and his nephews who are all in trouble because of him. And I’m facing financial difficulties myself for believing him (GSD)that I’m trying to avoid believing him. I wonder how much Mr Gill had to pay for his guruship.
Hi Sir!
Unfortunately it is entirely true.
You might have witnessed the initial act by Musk yourself. The destruction of the USAid program, which was providing Maleria and Aids medications to millions of children and adults suffering around the world.
Now, in the gap of mediation support, 700,000 children are perishing, and as many adults.
Rather than come up with a more cost effective, more efficient solution, rather than fix the problem so that these human beings received the promised medications, Musk decided all by himself to dismantle it, without any consideration of the impact or how to make a transition without hurting children around the world.
What happened to Musk, the level of corruption to engage in such cruelty is nearly unfathomable.
His entire definition of efficiency violates every principle of efficiency, which is to create better outcomes at lower cost. Not to abandon those we serve. How could such a leader of engineering leave his entire judgement and knowledge behind?
This is what happens when corruption sets in.
Brian Ji knows about this. It’s in the news. And I also provided links here as well. But he, and others, have chosen, even after this terrible and cruel crime against humanity, to put money into Musk’s pocket through the lease of a new Tesla.
If we could know the impact of our choices on innocent people, we would like to think we would make different purchasing decisions. We do vote with our dollars, perhaps even more powerfully than with our vote.
But sadly, faced even with this information, many ignore it, dismiss it, and do not do their own homework.
So much for actually caring about children.
And if you care about children, do at least this minimum work of two minutes and read the Harvard report:
https://hsph.harvard.edu/news/usaid-shutdown-has-led-to-hundreds-of-thousands-of-deaths/
Even before the studies came out, this was a terrible decision.
If anyone is serious about children, the impact should have been established by the DOGE office first, before changing anything.
It was a reckless, irresponsible and criminal act.
And I guess some choose to ignore it.
When you are in charge of a program treating patients with any illness at all, anywhere in the world, you are ethically bound to that patient to continue treatment until a suitable alternative is in place. This applies not only to nurses, doctors and technicians, but to hospital and healthcare clinic and outreach managers and administrators. And it most definitely applies to Musk. In one act he demonstrated his complete incompetency, and morale bankruptcy in leaving these patients that is program was responsible to care for, without adequate substitution.
Anyone who knowingly adds to this man’s power to do greater harm shares to a degree in that harm. We do vote with our dollars, and the slightest impacts on an organization’s or individual’s margins can have significant impact on behavior.
To ignore our complicity in the harm created just by our spending habits, is to relinquish all claim to ethics and morality.
We are not always aware of how children and other people suffer for what we consume.
But in this case, everyone who leases a new Tesla, knowing what Musk has done, enjoys their ride on the backs of dead and dying children.
And now you’ve made it your concern. Ironic isn’t it. It’s a dichotomy.
Now, as to those who have been initiated but refuse to do their job, meet their responsibility by staying true to the vows they took.
Falling is no crime. It’s part of the path for many.
You might learn loyalty before initiation of that was your destiny. But you might learn it afterward, seeing the personal loss of inner treasure from one or more falls.
But what you promised must be adopted whole heartedly at some point.
At some point you must accept you don’t know everything and must choose what to believe and what to do.
There was wisdom guiding you once. Try to remember.
And every choice is made with incomplete information.
Therefore faith and perseverance are necessary.
This entire conversation is to satisfy the mind.
And all the evidence that exists overwhelmingly points to the advantages of spiritual meditation.
We must live a balanced life, that’s true.
Meditation isn’t the only thing in life.
But life is much richer for it.
Return. If you have taken vows work to return. Start small, take small steps, but take them every day.
Allow yourself a little sunlight, a small bit of reflected sun in the absolute darkness of mind and opinion. The hope in a greater intelligence and wisdom and love right there inside you.
Be a better parent to your true self.
Yeah, you too. I’m quite contented.
Initiated by a false guru, who admits it on a regular basis. How many Gods in human form will it take before we realize we’ve been had ! All you have to do is rearrange the words in the Bible to say . I’m only the son of God. Not the only son of God. But Gurinder doesn’t think he is either. Aramaic is like Arabic it’s read from right to left so it’s very easy to misinterpret the Bible that was originally written in Aramaic and maybe Greek. Jesus wasn’t even the white person they have on the walls. Not that a previous Masters matter that much . But it’s getting so that the present day Masters don’t matter at all .
Ron, it comes down to just one thing.
To love someone greater than yourself.
It’s quite a stretch for some folks, and there lay before them their next challenge.
” may your love of the form lead to your love of the formless” Charan Singh ji. It’s wrong to worship photographs and it’s wrong to keep worshiping the physical is what he’s trying to say so much better than I. I seriously doubt Gurinder could ever dive that deep to say anything that poetic. You shouldn’t have said grudge because I’m starting to dig it. In fact I’m going to start holding a grudge against Gurinder again to see if that’s any fun. Someone asked him if he ever wrote a book what would it be called and he answered. ” I Heard God Laughing” . And finally he did but he started getting crow’s feet from it. Yeah I’m the one. The one they call the 7th son.
If the form leads you to the formless that’s right. But that formless won’t be the you that writes here. It won’t be your ego.
“We have no right to call God our Father if we cannot call all men our brothers.”
Sawan Singh
I don’t see quotation marks around the first part so I think you made that up. Yeah I think it’s false. Sorry I don’t agree. Anyway Sawan was then and this is now. The only thing that remains is the formless. Of course not and I don’t worship myself. Anyway you’re mixing apples and oranges like you always do. I don’t mean to call you a troll but if you are one do it somewhere else. It’s important to me to be wrong.
Sorry Ron, yes proceed with being wrong, you are in good company. I’m right there with you, bro.
Satsangis are not any greater than non satsangis. Thanks brother you’ve made my whole point for me. I consider myself only a guru to the lowest of the low which puts me below almost everyone. Just because satsangis need it more doesn’t mean God gives them more. I actually feel like you men and women aren’t getting enough love at home that you have to go look for someone greater than you. My wife is greater than me and I don’t even have to leave the house to learn that in church. I know druggies and alcoholics need a higher power even if it’s the corner of the room but Gurinder is into that AA stuff and I’m not. I’m tired of making the same point to you and you not seeing it. I don’t sense brotherhood from you going in any kind of direction. You love to put down people I don’t know where that comes from cuz ain’t nobody better than you.
Ron, I hear you. But it isn’t about you or I. It is about reality, which is much greater than either of us, and the way each of us appreciates it.
The same reality we both live in.
For some, it is the love of a good companion.
For others it is the love of a son or daughter.
For some the love of their brother’s and sisters. For some the love of a perfect ideal.
For others, a great idea.
And for others it is the love of their Master.
Love whom you love.
Who can cast judgment on that?
And in that love, is there room for hatred?
I think all that gets left behind.
Love or hate?
Each moment is a challenge to our own ethics.
But, to the extent I can, I advocate the high road, and yes, promote it.
Now, that is the path of love, but you find that love.
If the love of another helps anyone let go and overcome the grudges they carry, for we all carry baggage, that is a higher love.
For me, that is the sign post.
And so each day rather than indulge in hate, which becomes a heir, I choose love.
It’s been done before. My Master is the ultimate example. But members of my family and good friends struggle with the same challenge.
The moment by moment decision to pull back from hate and choose love.
And in time that becomes a habit.
The only cost is all that defined us.
Should we be defined and identified by what we hate, by our ability to find out make wrong?
Or The opposite, the ability to transcend wrong and right. No hate, no comparisons can live there.
The cost of love. Well, it’s a moment by moment decision, a choice to cost thy higher love, the one that knows no hatred.
I don’t write these things so that you can judge me as an individual. I am filled with flaws. But love is also there.
That’s what I’m trying to write about.
You can’t make wrong or critique others with any integrity if you can’t also be wrong.
But then, so what? Now wet are both wrong.
Give up hate, give up the grudge and you might find that all is fine.
Love whom you love, live and let others live and love without blame or shame.
I suggest that you not read any of my posts and comments because it doesn’t mean that much to me to mean that much to you
Overcoming grudges does not need love but insight in the psychological mechanism underneath it.
Kind of understanding the gears in a car….
First step it is to stop for a moment to make the same movement with the handle of the gearbox that has led to the unwanted gear.
Next figuring out an NEW movement to find the correct gear.
It is letting go of an ingrained habit to begin with … no love needed
Well … besides the love for the grudge.
It can be difficult to let go of a plant one has cared for for so long …attachment.
most people love their grudges as it gives them a feeling of being alive an running … this very blog tells this simple truth
Hi Um
Yes, understanding might help to give up a grudge.
But having the love of a good friend makes that possible.
It is a little complicated …I had a rather heavy grudge against my mother … and in the process that had to be done to come to understand the psychological mechanism … my mother played a role as well as the late mcs … but the work was done by me …. quite a lot.
Let me add this much … listening to him made me understand quite a lot of psychological mechanisms of human mind … so much so that made me label him as a psychologist…upon which he ask if he had take it as a compliment …upon my heartfelt agreement … he gave an exposee on psychology that is one of the treasures I took away.
From within the narrative it is not difficult to SUGGEST that he was the friend you refer to … but…that has never been my point of view, not then not know.
I used his words to understand human mind I hardly believe he had that intention …being a spiritual teacher and a professional lawyer.
Nobody can help another human being .. as a manager you might think so but it is an professional illusion … well payed of course
Hi Um we were meant to help each other:
“If we can do anything to help anybody, we should. That is our duty – we are meant to help each other. Humans are meant to help humans. Who else will help? Birds and plants won’t come to help you – you have to help each other. We should be a source of strength to each other.… Your heart should be very, very soft to other people and you should be very compassionate, very kind.”
Spiritual Perspectives, Vol. III
The main issue is that we simply take ourselves out of it altogether, certainly as much as we can. Who gave us the time, opportunity or skill? Master. So, we have nothing to be proud of. But if we waste the opportunity in “Me” or “You” then of course, that is wasted time. We can most certainly regret that.
If something good or bad happens, how can that be any concern of ours?
When something good happens, how did all the elements, especially those that had nothing to do with us, come together? He did that.
Look within. Every element you may find within yourself is sourced in the distant past. You inherited, you didn’t create.
When the best efforts fail, who to blame? We are all imperfect, but if we can use this as a self-teaching opportunity and learn something, then it has a silver lining, some purpose. In the future we can feel better that we are now helping in a more sensitive, aware way than we did before.
It is true that since we fail every day, we are bound to cause some ill feelings and some harm even with our best efforts not to. Sometimes it can’t be helped. But then, we can make a comittment that honors our intention to help while firmly committing not to proceed as we had.
Forgiveness of others and especially ourselves opens the door to easy personal change, and the diligence to make those changes.
Where do we find the strength to let go of our ego, our attachment to our own behavior and persona? In His Love within. That is the alternative to our failings.
We may not see clearly, but a lit room is infinitely superior than a dark one.
So we do the work every day. That’s the practice. That’s attending Satsang. It’s all about training the mind, controlling the mind, disciplining the mind to allow us to spend time beyond mind and thought with Him.
If I bill for 10 hours but put 30 into it, is that really all paid work?
And if I love Him and give all my time without charge, am I not hoping for the payment of His grace?
Yet, He gives his grace in rain or shine, “The sunrises on the evil and the good” – Christ.
So, we cannot even judge our selves. But we can put our attention on Him.
Mr. Tepper there is no reason for you to lecture me or anybody else.
The longer you continue the more you will be exposed as to what you are doing here… it will become visible to all, not only to the trained eye of professionals but the lay people as well.
As to the help:
He made it clear to me that nobody had to leave his or her path of life in order to help others unless it was part of ones professional duties attached to a given social position….but if a person would cross the path of live we were supposed to help….realizing what the effect of that help entailed as we are co-responsive for the help given.
I’m starting to believe this commenter is actually Gurinder himself, the RSSB word salad nonsense yelling feels like him
Love, by the way, comes in two forms, dual an non-dual
the dual form appears always with its shadow, hatred
The non dual lacks both aspects of the dual form … so does easily appear as non-love.
Non dual love is associate with insight, understanding knowledge … gyan is different from bhakti
Those that teach bhakti are often gyan teachers and the other way around.
Hmm….better take some coffee than this…giving in to urge to illustrate it with examples
I have also found two kinds of love:
1. ME. I want, I enjoy… l want you, I want to own and control this, that, you, them. Me, Mine. I consume things, people, places, time, ideas. I destroy and consume what I have destroyed. I create and own, possess and master. This is my pleasure. This is my property. You belong to me…. This can be rightly called selfish love.
2. YOU. I surrender, you are everything. I no longer exist. All I want is to dissappear within you, to cease to be separate. I cant help but be at your side, in your service, at your feet, to give all is a priviledge, to transcend and evaporate in submission to You.This can rightly be called selfless love.
To those within whom lives of the first type, they know nothing of the second, assuming it to be the first.
To those within whom lives the second type, they see the first type as it really is, a form of self-hatred
Have you ever heard of fiction writers or author who is a King compelled to write and even though it’s just fiction and he’s perfectly calm . He can stir up your imagination and make you think. Stir up the demons that you project on his words, not him. That’s me, no grudge no hate;) that’s me nothing to be afraid of. That’s me no :-$fear that’s me : the inheritor of heaven 🍰. And if you’re not a creep you have nothing to worry about.
If you say so.
AI says so , C