Below is another in a series of guest blog posts from Anon, an ex-RSSB initiate. RSSB stands for Radha Soami Satsang Beas, an India-based religious organization headed up by a guru that I belonged to for 35 years, which explains my interest in sharing criticisms of the faith that I also found lacking.
After Anon’s post, I’ll share some thoughts from another RSSB critic that roughly reflect what Anon is saying here.
RSSB: Generational Gulf
In my time at RSSB I saw a lot of multi generational goers. RSSB was majority and overwhelmingly Indian, even at Western centres. RSSB genuinely faces a generational gulf which it seems to ignore. Many people just failed to grasp different gurus had different contexts and different disciples – why did everyone ignore this totally?
GEN 1: The Grandparents (The Survivors): Survived the horrors of the Indian Partition and colonisation. For them, faith and traditional values were the only anchors in turbulent life or death times. Sawan oversaw RSSB expansion in India – Dera expansion. This gen used Dera as a spiritual oasis where all were welcome (regardless of caste, religion, homeland) and there was no violence onsite. Sawan focused on urgent karmic recovery, brotherhood, humanity, kindness.
GEN 2: The Parents (The Migrants): Emigrated to the West under Maharaj Charan Singh. This gen used strict RSSB vows (diet, lifestyle, morals) as a protective bubble to keep from losing their Indian identity. Charan oversaw huge RSSB expansion in the Western world. Charan preached following strict lifestyle vows, even if it made you a social outcast in the West, which he specifically addressed.
GEN 3: The Kids (The “Next Gen”): Born and raised in the West, or under India as a global superpower with western influences. Many in the West view their Indian heritage as a valued “add-on” rather than their entire identity, and many in India live the same modern lifestyles as Western counterparts. GSD as the guru oversees all centres. GSD is mainly known for continuing to uphold and desperately clinging to RSSB values amid changing modernising times. RSSB is known for digital/tech bans. GSD is known for his own legal and financial controversy reported in mass media.
GEN 4. This will be the Gill generation. Time will tell.
CONFLICT
The point is – RSSB isn’t just faith.
For many it is also a cultural legacy, a family legacy, storytelling, an inherited way of life and a mindset, Indian history, cultural values, family relationships, Eastern spirituality and survival.
Many older generation disciples simply fused Indianism, culture, heritage, family, identity and spirituality all together.
From what I saw, it did make it harder for the next gen to step back from RSSB without it being a huge identity betrayal (which it isn’t). It was honestly all so enmeshed that for many it was really difficult or simply not possible to extract themselves from RSSB – the roots ran deep.
Anon.
Today I made some changes to the improvements in the Search box in the right sidebar, which are based on SearchWP. Now up to 20 results are shown for a search, instead of the previous seven. Trying out that change, I came across a 2009 post, “Chapter 4 of RSSB expose: belief system critique.” I started that post with:
Here’s the final installment of material sent to me by an email correspondent, Unknown, who assembled writings by a high-ranking Radha Soami Satsang Beas official (who called himself Waking Now) that appeared online some years ago after Waking Now became disillusioned with what he came to view as a cult.
Previous postings of Waking Now’s writings are here, here, here, and here. This installment, which mostly is a critique of the RSSB belief system, is my favorite.
Here’s excerpts from Waking Now’s writing that reminded me of what Anon spoke of in his guest blog post above.
It is only after one has been out of the cult for some time that one realizes the subtle mind control techniques one was subjected to.
It starts with the talks repeating endlessly that the God Incarnate Guru sitting before you in person or photograph is essential for achieving God realization, and doing Sewa (service) to Him in all the prescribed ways (including free labour and donations for property development) accumulates ‘real’ spiritual treasure whereas looking after family and community is to be endured as a karmic burden of the Negative power.
Then one learns to utter the cult code word as greeting to each other so one is recognized in the cult Family. No more good morning or good evening but RadhaSoami. Then, if anything good happens, one learns to say, it is Master’s (Maharaj Ji’s, Baba Ji’s) Grace. If something bad happens, one learns to say, it is my bad Karma. (From His side, Heads I win, Tails you lose, how clever!)
If you ask a cult member, how are you?, He learns to say, I am well by Master’s Grace. The cult member’s gratitude for the gift of life no longer includes the infinite Cosmos (God) which supported all life including his own from the beginning of time.
In his meditation the cult member learns to pray to the Guru for his well being. So even when he is taken advantage of by the Guru and his Officers, he is habituated to praying to the Guru for relief. Like the little child who on being mistreated by a parent only knows to cry to help to the Mama or Papa.
After such indoctrination, it is not surprising that for most cult members the God Incarnate’s Grace idea is so deeply imprinted that they are unable to accept that they are being taken advantage of in a worldly way.
I imagine that if such cult members are lucky, some great internal or external event will shake them out of mind control.
Otherwise, C’est la vie.
…The dependence of the followers on the immaculate God Incarnate Guru is encouraged and reinforced at every step of a cult member’s life. It starts by naming the cult head, Mararaj Ji, the Great Respected Lord. This great Lord is touted to be the source of Grace for the lowly member. At initiation, the member is asked to think of the Great Lord during meditation. He is told to remember the Great Lord for help at time of worldly trouble.
He is asked to come to the Great Lord’s public rallies as much as possible for receiving a glance of Grace and told to regularly attend the indoctrination sessions (satsangs). He is encouraged to contribute as much as possible (Sewa) to the Great Lord’s work so that he receives ‘cash’ (that is, instant) spiritual benefits. (If he starts questioning where the touted benefits are, he is smothered by the explanations that he is to blame due to past karmas or due to not doing the full 2.5 hours meditation everyday, which would disqualify most of the members, or due to being on the first of his four lives for getting them. In any case, he can still enjoy the group highs at gatherings.)
Even when mistreated by the Great Lord or his minions, the cult member is encouraged to think that the Great Lord is clearing his past sins (karmas). After a few years, a member’s mind is so filled with God Incarnate beliefs that it is no longer easy to see with an open mind.
For many, it is a social support issue. The cult community is the only one they have since after joining they have become alienated from all normal relations with the world outside of their God Incarnate circle. Also, as vegetarians and teetotalers, they are no longer comfortable in situations where people eat and drink.
Having become a dependent vine, it is difficult to transform into a self-supporting tree but, thank God, not impossible. The first step is to try standing and walking on ones own.
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” Sawan oversaw RSSB expansion in India – Dera expansion. This gen used Dera as a spiritual oasis where all were welcome (regardless of caste, religion, homeland) and there was no violence onsite. Sawan focused on urgent karmic recovery, brotherhood, humanity, kindness.” My sanskaras. But let’s talk about this current lifespan . I can’t just sit around and live off my laurels or wait a minute. Yes I can haha. Sawan was quite the independent so no wonder we reincarnated into the United States of America. But I don’t sense much love on this Path of Love. Remember that’s the other name of it it’s hardly referred to that anymore because everyone loves their damn computer more than they do other people.
Now since this is the path of self-realization before God realization let me tell you how I operated in RSST. I started writing direct to the master and cut out the middleman Representatives completely and operated like that to this day. I do not attend regularly meetings that aren’t required. I did smoke hookah up until about 15 years ago. Now that has nothing to do with it since Gurinder told me he had all kinds of pills laying around in 2009. That’s what I find interesting while I was talking to him I had no idea of all these administrative and operational issues of rssb. All the initiates I knew in Texas just about all smoked weed after initiation in the 1970s anyway but I was still too young to be initiated so I joined them. And I wasn’t going to apply for initiation until after I was of age but by then I was doing other drugs and I wasn’t going to lie to anybody about it because I didn’t see anything wrong with it. I never had a drug problem. But remember this is the path of love. So I was already on the path of love during all of my trials and tribulations I knew what path I was on and it was a path directly between me and the master ( whoever or whatever that was or is.) RSSB is so far off the mark now that even if I was Sawan Singh in my last life I don’t recognize my creation. I wonder if this is how God feels about all of the Earth. He doesn’t even recognize his own creation anymore. I’ll laugh louder than anyone if I’m not in Gurinder’s Will. I’m not going to speak ill of him after he’s gone.
Sawan may as well have been describing Austin Texas from the mid to late ’60s to the mid-80s. Groovers Paradise. Willie Nelson , guru onsite. And then that time Gurinder told me that they were giving him opium for his migraines. That’s when I found out perfect Masters could get cancer. And didn’t necessarily want to be one although I could have been one in my last life is what he said. Past Masters is what Paul McCartney said. He was my witness as God was my witness when the rooster crowed great great great three times.
Anon identifies, but poorly, the distinction between the culture of India version of RSSB, the teachings, the practice and the organization, all with some truth and quite a bit of inaccuracy.
He has a grudge. And here we see his biggest shortcoming continues to come to light. He cannot set decent healthy boundaries, and therefore confuses the desire for others to encourage him with what they believe, and his own violation of his personal boundaries. He projects his youth and inability to set boundaries onto RSSB.
What is a very simple organization of faith and spiritual practice, and personal investigation, to raise consciousness, becomes a cult to Anon, in the absence of his ability simply to say, “no thank you. It’s not my cup of tea.”
We have seen this issue with Anon in practically every one of his posts, and it is glaring. Had he only learned, as we all do, to set boundaries, often after they have been crossed. But instead, he does not accept his personal responsibility and projects the problem upon others.
It is as if he never met happily functional Indian families whose kids have grown up respecting RSSB, but with no immediate interest or intentions. And all function quite well with mutual respect.
Again, it’s an issue of boundaries, where each family member celebrates the differences, or at least honors them, knowing that love prevails, should prevail, must prevail for everyone’s health. And there is a trust that Master / God / Providence is taking each of us through out destiny in the protection of a benevolent power.
I realize this issue may be shared by others. But most of us, at some point, recognize that every single human being has their own sense of how to live best and would live others to live like that. Unfortunately, Anon, like Brian Ji, has now fallen into the same trap.
Healthy Boundaries. It’s good for you, and for everyone else. Then, you can go anywhere and enjoy everyone’s company, and everyone’s wisdom.
This is part and parcel of Sant Mat, and one of the main benefits of struggling with another teaching: Blame is not permitted in Sant Mat.
And so Anon and Brian Ji, like addicts, addicted to their grudge, double and triple down on it, taking them further and further into duality, further away from Oneness, which requires personal responsibility.
Here’s a prime sample of RSSB people’s behaviour, when you want to leave RSSB.
Wow a real troll.
It’s OK Tense, you can come out from under the bridge. All are welcome here.
Any answers :
Dear Brian, Greetings!
May I ask you few things.
You started this blog and you openly criticise RSSB, it’s okay if you criticise. But can you openly criticise any other religion. Can you criticise Christ, gods of other religions or their beliefs ??
Can you openly challenge them and say things same like you say about RSSB ?
I offer you to do that & then tell me the difference. Let me warn you that you will not be treated good.
You say so much things on RSSB but did they ever tried to contact you or anyone called you and gave you threats over the phone, email or any other source of contact ? Did RSSB took any action on you ? Opposite of that kindly try to do with other religions and with so called god associations and then feel the difference.
Instead of that I don’t want to remind you about your book. How it is possible that you criticise someone and they support you.
You may ignore these things but you must give sometime to think on this. Ask your inner self. I hope you will do it really.
You gave 35 years to this association.. you started this blog because of that (think about this). What you gain or what you loose you know better.
What have RSSB taken from you. It’s your own belief that you started following and it’s your own wish to leave this association. Does anybody pushes you to join or anybody pushes you to leave? No you decide whenever you wanted to join or whenever you wanted to leave.
Opposite of it you gained from them(think about it).
I beg your pardon but how blind you are that you follow Indian news papers, you believe on random people who sent you email, message, the news websites, online links & blogs. You believe on people who randomly come on your blog and comment always bad about RSSB.
Do you think this is a smart move or appropriate way to criticise someone ? Are you so tangible ? Are you a kid who just believe whatever people say to him or he see ?
Do you know these people? Do you know what have they done in their personal life or what is their background? Do you even know that how news businesses in the world works ? You just read somewhere and post a blog here.
So what should I say to you ?
Brian, please I again request you humbly if you want to write about RSSB come to India. Do your own research ? I will help you. You may write bad or good after that, it does not matter but do yourself. If you really on it.
Do not write or copy paste others perspectives blindly. Do you really think they are saying truth? What are their intentions behind this ? How bad they have done in their lives ? Good or bad does not matter.
If you can’t control this for me you are blind with a very childish mind and you are doing this because of your 35 years grudge. That you didn’t see anything.
Why did not you criticise Christ ? I afraid If you were alive in his time you would have been with those people who were against the Christ and his teachings. Because people put many allegations on him and it was easy to make you believe on them as you do same now.
I hope you have seen everything inside now after unfollowing RSSB.
Criticising is not a bad thing Brian but criticising someone because you didn’t feel anything does not mean others didn’t. It depends on many things. Criticising someone because everyone doing so does not give you right to do the same. Here comes the wisdom and research. Rssb is an easy target, Do you know why ? Because they are not going to punish you or do anything against you. You know better but you will not accept because your old grudges and stubborn was not letting you do that.
But whatever it is, I don’t think RSSB ever criticised you or give you any threats.
There are many things I want to say but message will be so long. I think I send same kind of message a year ago but you never replied.
It’s okay.. I wish you with your own innermost know the answers, you accept it or not.
I request you again do not believe in random people’s random messages. In this world we easily adopt the bad things.
My Sincere Regards,
One more point about healthy boundaries. When you don’t have them, when you haven’t recognized and honored them in yourself, you don’t see them in others. And when you don’t see their boundaries, you can’t respect them. All you see are your notions of good and evil, you being good and everything else that is different from you being evil. And so you claim the right to impose your beliefs because you aren’t imposing them. The others don’t actually exist for you. That is why you never have to consider whether you are respecting them or not. They are evil to you and don’t deserve such recognition or respect.
And there is the foundation you lay for a real cult.
This is gaslighting.
If you can accept people for who they are you aren’t gaslighting..
If you are holding a grudge against others, and resent being called out on it, then who is gaslighting?
My question to Brian:
Dear Brian, Greetings!
May I ask you few things.
You started this blog and you openly criticise RSSB, it’s okay if you criticise. But can you openly criticise any other religion. Can you criticise Christ, gods of other religions or their beliefs ??
Can you openly challenge them and say things same like you say about RSSB ?
I offer you to do that & then tell me the difference. Let me warn you that you will not be treated good.
You say so much things on RSSB but did they ever tried to contact you or anyone called you and gave you threats over the phone, email or any other source of contact ? Did RSSB took any action on you ? Opposite of that kindly try to do with other religions and with so called god associations and then feel the difference.
Instead of that I don’t want to remind you about your book. How it is possible that you criticise someone and they support you.
You may ignore these things but you must give sometime to think on this. Ask your inner self. I hope you will do it really.
You gave 35 years to this association.. you started this blog because of that (think about this). What you gain or what you loose you know better.
What have RSSB taken from you. It’s your own belief that you started following and it’s your own wish to leave this association. Does anybody pushes you to join or anybody pushes you to leave? No you decide whenever you wanted to join or whenever you wanted to leave.
Opposite of it you gained from them(think about it).
I beg your pardon but how blind you are that you follow Indian news papers, you believe on random people who sent you email, message, the news websites, online links & blogs. You believe on people who randomly come on your blog and comment always bad about RSSB.
Do you think this is a smart move or appropriate way to criticise someone ? Are you so tangible ? Are you a kid who just believe whatever people say to him or he see ?
Do you know these people? Do you know what have they done in their personal life or what is their background? Do you even know that how news businesses in the world works ? You just read somewhere and post a blog here.
So what should I say to you ?
Brian, please I again request you humbly if you want to write about RSSB come to India. Do your own research ? I will help you. You may write bad or good after that, it does not matter but do yourself. If you really on it.
Do not write or copy paste others perspectives blindly. Do you really think they are saying truth? What are their intentions behind this ? How bad they have done in their lives ? Good or bad does not matter.
If you can’t control this for me you are blind with a very childish mind and you are doing this because of your 35 years grudge. That you didn’t see anything.
Why did not you criticise Christ ? I afraid If you were alive in his time you would have been with those people who were against the Christ and his teachings. Because people put many allegations on him and it was easy to make you believe on them as you do same now.
I hope you have seen everything inside now after unfollowing RSSB.
Criticising is not a bad thing Brian but criticising someone because you didn’t feel anything does not mean others didn’t. It depends on many things. Criticising someone because everyone doing so does not give you right to do the same. Here comes the wisdom and research. Rssb is an easy target, Do you know why ? Because they are not going to punish you or do anything against you. You know better but you will not accept because your old grudges and stubborn was not letting you do that.
But whatever it is, I don’t think RSSB ever criticised you or give you any threats.
There are many things I want to say but message will be so long. I think I send same kind of message a year ago but you never replied.
It’s okay.. I wish you with your own innermost know the answers, you accept it or not.
I request you again do not believe in random people’s random messages. In this world we easily adopt the bad things.
My Sincere Regards,
“It was honestly all so enmeshed that for many it was really difficult or simply not possible to extract themselves from RSSB – the roots ran deep.”
Translation: Indians of all these generations are deathly afraid of bucking family authority. Just like Charan was.
Quite ironic actually. Westerners who join RSSB are invariably considered rebels by their families. But the dynamic is precisely the opposite for Indians who grew up in satsangi families.
Either way, big effing deal. If you’re afraid of what people think about your religious convictions, grow some balls. The problem isn’t RSSB, it’s you.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-43522574
Love it Tense . Are you really the same person as Spence and just created this alter ego . Looks good on screen.
Sant64 is right. And that ends when one stops identifying as a victim, when everyone has the ruby slippers.
https://churchofthechurchless.com/2026/05/heres-all-of-the-fascinating-posts-critical-of-rssb-by-anon-an-ex-rssb-initiate/#comment-76615
All the Dera,s in Panjab were the creation of British as Panjab was the last State to fall to British Empire after the death of Maharaja Ranjit Singh , but people of Panjab started to attack British interests in Panjab . To control this they used their servants in the Army like Jaimal Singh/Sawan Singh etc. After 1947 controlling Public through Religion was taken over by new Brown Rulers ,this continues to present day India Rulers .
Mao made an end to the feudal regime of the Chinese emperors and its suppression of the masses.
Colorful dressed mandarins are now replaced by ” the green men”.
What has changed?
Do not all “liberators” become the new dictators …. ??
Nothing changes for working people , white rulers in India got replaced Brown Rulers ,these Brown Rulers have even lower morale than previous rulers, same in South Africa & Rhodesia ( Zimbabwe ) .
Power is always replaced by new power … only the form changes.
The need of controll never changes … if the tools and the means are not longer acceptable they stop to be used …it seems that the controll too has gone but that is an illusion.
Even in your own life
My questions to Brian:
Dear Brian, Greetings!
May I ask you few things.
You started this blog and you openly criticise RSSB, it’s okay if you criticise. But can you openly criticise any other religion. Can you criticise Christ, gods of other religions or their beliefs ??
Can you openly challenge them and say things same like you say about RSSB ?
I offer you to do that & then tell me the difference. Let me warn you that you will not be treated good.
You say so much things on RSSB but did they ever tried to contact you or anyone called you and gave you threats over the phone, email or any other source of contact ? Did RSSB took any action on you ? Opposite of that kindly try to do with other religions and with so called god associations and then feel the difference.
Instead of that I don’t want to remind you about your book. How it is possible that you criticise someone and they support you.
You may ignore these things but you must give sometime to think on this. Ask your inner self. I hope you will do it really.
You gave 35 years to this association.. you started this blog because of that (think about this). What you gain or what you loose you know better.
What have RSSB taken from you. It’s your own belief that you started following and it’s your own wish to leave this association. Does anybody pushes you to join or anybody pushes you to leave? No you decide whenever you wanted to join or whenever you wanted to leave.
Opposite of it you gained from them(think about it).
I beg your pardon but how blind you are that you follow Indian news papers, you believe on random people who sent you email, message, the news websites, online links & blogs. You believe on people who randomly come on your blog and comment always bad about RSSB.
Do you think this is a smart move or appropriate way to criticise someone ? Are you so tangible ? Are you a kid who just believe whatever people say to him or he see ?
Do you know these people? Do you know what have they done in their personal life or what is their background? Do you even know that how news businesses in the world works ? You just read somewhere and post a blog here.
So what should I say to you ?
Brian, please I again request you humbly if you want to write about RSSB come to India. Do your own research ? I will help you. You may write bad or good after that, it does not matter but do yourself. If you really on it.
Do not write or copy paste others perspectives blindly. Do you really think they are saying truth? What are their intentions behind this ? How bad they have done in their lives ? Good or bad does not matter.
If you can’t control this for me you are blind with a very childish mind and you are doing this because of your 35 years grudge. That you didn’t see anything.
Why did not you criticise Christ ? I afraid If you were alive in his time you would have been with those people who were against the Christ and his teachings. Because people put many allegations on him and it was easy to make you believe on them as you do same now.
I hope you have seen everything inside now after unfollowing RSSB.
Criticising is not a bad thing Brian but criticising someone because you didn’t feel anything does not mean others didn’t. It depends on many things. Criticising someone because everyone doing so does not give you right to do the same. Here comes the wisdom and research. Rssb is an easy target, Do you know why ? Because they are not going to punish you or do anything against you. You know better but you will not accept because your old grudges and stubborn was not letting you do that.
But whatever it is, I don’t think RSSB ever criticised you or give you any threats.
There are many things I want to say but message will be so long. I think I send same kind of message a year ago but you never replied.
It’s okay.. I wish you with your own innermost know the answers, you accept it or not.
I request you again do not believe in random people’s random messages. In this world we easily adopt the bad things.
My Sincere Regards,
Blame , grudges, open boundaries and duality all exist for ex rssb. It’s more welcoming than RSSB. 😂 😭
The content of Anon’s blogs, some of Brian’s posts, and several other commentators on RSSB describe pretty accurately how cults operate. The RSSB organisation does seem to fit the bill of a cult. I don’t think such writings exhibit grudges; they could be, but are more likely to be self-justification for leaving; information to others in the process of leaving; a way of ongoing deprogramming – or perhaps simply, telling the truth as it happened to them.
What interests me about those who become habituated to believing all manner of explanations for phenomena that support no evidence is how such teachings become an integral part of the participants’ identity. As we know, that which supports a person’s identity can become sacrosanct. People vigorously defend their perceived identities and, in the realm of beliefs, continue to uphold them in the face of contrary evidence. For some (perhaps many), the only way to counter opposing opinions is to undermine
Most “counter opposing opinions” do have the same pscholicsl mechanisms behind them as those defending them.
Why should anybody raise his voice with tdgards to his beliefs, his identities and the value and meaning attributed to them.
Imo those that walks the street pro and contra something are psychological the same
Hi Ron E.
Well, we have people here holding a grudge against a guy for decades without evidence. Holding opinions against x or against Y then defines an individual just as beliefs in something, beliefs for something.
But as you say, these are personal issues. No one would persust in seeking items of blame, all on the basis of appearances, to hurl at someone year after year unless they already held a grudge against that person. I don’t think that is very healthy.
Similarly, no one would adopt a belief in God and through that accept whatever tenets that belief involved unless something personal happened to them, inside them. That could be for some a very positive event.
What makes belief intolerable to others, so that they must make personal accusations of fault or error towards the entire population of believers?
I believe it has to do with locus of control. An external locus of control explains the grudge. It also explains atheism.
If you believe for example, as Brian Ji, Um and Anon appear to believe, that all our problems were caused by others and that we hold no personal responsibility, then defining our situation, our role in life and our very homeostasis, requires that the picture of those we have made our enemies is sustained in order for us to sustain our self-image and our self-esteem.
We define ourselves in contrast to these comic book villains we ourselves have drawn. And so this is how we gain in our own eyes value. And we gain strength through others who believe as we do, who hate what we hate.
I how you can see how having an external locus of control is a necessary oopulatuon for every tyrant seeking power.
It is the monsters we make of others that sustains our own ego and self-identity, for those with an external locus of control. This explains the grudge and why it is fed year in and year out.
For the individual with an internal locus of control everything we encounter, everything in our environment is our doing, either the past or what we do today that shapes tomorrow. All that really make us is our own internal state and our value comes from the strength we derive within, exploring and honoring what is within us. Other people’s opinions do not hold the influence on those with an internal locus of control that they do with those who have an external locus of control.
What is inside of us, our experience and character is our responsibility alone. Therefore if God exists he must be within, part of our own constructuon. When we surrender ourselves to God, it is within. God cannot actually exist outside as a separate entity for the person with internal locus of control. That can only be a reflection. The real God is always within, exactly where the person with external locus is control cannot go.
And as part of that internal locus of control, no blame is therefore permitted. Blame of others, the fountain of grudges, undermines our own internal locus of control.
In several psychological experiments, locus of control as a measured trait was seen to be largely predetermined, but it could be influenced by education. We can be taught to complain or taught to rely upon ourselves. But the two generally lead in different directions.
You may read some introductory remarks about locus of control here
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locus_of_control
No, Mr tepper
I never …NEVER….wrote, suggested nor do I believe what YOU ATTRIBUTE to me….that everything is caused by others.
your stating that makes again clear how you operate here
Mr tepper in case you do not understand …. by “owning” the positive and the good, by necessity the opposite is out- sourced ….outsourced Mr tepper … on OTHERS.
missionaries need people
Hi Um
You can see from the inside what it is like to be placed inside a box by someone else, for which I apologize.
And how indignant you are to be on the receiving end!
That box can never be right, whether I am putting you into one, or you are putting me into one.
Snake oil or snake poison. It isn’t good food.
So what is the point of blaming others for our ills, someone else’s bills or the ills of society?
Still doesn’t read to me like a grudge, a sense of resentment. I would say (again) that those posts are more accurately read as justifications for leaving, or self deprogramming.
Now you could be resentful that people are critizing your adopted belief structure, hence the reason you bother to comment and attempt to justify your beliefs and experiences.
I’d wonder, what if experiences in meditation etc. are actually biological; just the brain/body organism responding to stimuli imposed on it during intense activity. Sounds, visions etc. can all be perfectly natural (biological). Or, they could be something other.
Truth is no one really knows. All that we think we know is merely past thoughts being replayed through memory. A dead past that we cling onto believing it to have some meaning, some relevance.
All you, l and anyone else ‘knows’ is the awareness of the experience that is now. All else is past thought and where one is unaware, inattentive, even present life happenings can be habitually reduced to being overlayed by the dead past.
Basically, perhaps there is no ‘you’ to have experiences. No ‘you’ to experience anything, just a perfectly adapted organism that is biologically geared to respond to its environment – all without the need of a me, a controller.
Hi Ron E.
If there is no you then you have nothing to defend. There is no use living in the past, and therefore all the injury of the past is gone, belonged to someone else who isn’t here anymore, and you are entirely new, born in this moment, and again now in This moment.
And why return to a part that doesn’t exist? Where is the need to justify or to blame when all that is no more and you have no connection to it anymore?
But for some that attachment remains. What What was love has now become hate. There is the resentment you were looking for. The grudge.
Nothing else explains it. There is no attachment otherwise.
As for inner experience, whatever it is it is real for some, and only their Master understands it, is the Master of it.
If all is only now then there is no need for the past at all, as you write.
To dredge these things up over and over again is to present a dark history that is hopelessly subjective and unnecessary.
To compound that seeking fresh fuel for hatred, new acts to blame ad nauseum on the same person is hatred.
But if you must prove someone wrong, if you must dredge up what you wish had never happened, what else is that but an unresolved grudge?
What makes this a grudge? Hatred.
And then in your hatred you are happy it happened. Now you feel justified to hate.
Otherwise, if you took such pains to get to a better place, and you really are here now, live there. Why leave Now and go back to That? Every instant you do so you give up what you worked for.
Unresolved hate, anger:grudge.
Ron E.
I think this goes back to what you said, having to somehow justify someone’s decision to leave off the vows or the practice, or to turn from Master.
No one needs to justify this, Ron. It can’t be justified. But it can be understood. Conditioning, biochemistry, and one’s own personal experience.
The need to somehow justify might just be, as you suggest, the driver of all this hatred, this grudge.
The mystic that brought me to the path said I should resist as long as I can, and only apply for initiation when I simply cannot survive without it.
So, it was only when I saw things from a different place, that having this relationship with Master became a matter of personal survival. So personal, so intimate.
I can fully understand anyone making a different decision. These are individual, personal and intimate things.
Sp why defend one’s actions? To who? The attack, if it is just to justify one’s position, is being made to people who hold the position you are against. You don’t agree with those people, so why justify anything to them? It is a waste of time, it can’t be done effectively, and again, deepens the grudge.
Any spirituality that is credible takes you as you are, understands we are all on a journey that has it’s different twists and turns, and we can’t really say how it will turn out.
I believe it will turn out well. So then there is certainly no need for me to make judgements when the work isn’t finished yet. Nor even then. We are spending time in a place where there is no duality, so seeing from that perspective this is all illusion. Life really is just a dream and its twists and turns need no justification nor blame.
Living in the hear and now. Who can say what an experience that really is? If you can work your way past all the filters, it is amazing. We are all ripples on the same cosmic sea. What ripple says to another “You are a good ripple, this is a good ripple, this is a bad one!”
Anyone who feels they must make a decision for their own good should do so. If you want advice before making the decision, a good friend can help. But once you decide, you are just acting as part of the same reality I also occupy, along with every soul in this creation all in the same timeless NOW moment. If you can make a decision that harms no one, that is really best. But we need to be at a very high place to see the repurcussions of our actions, and not all pleasant things are good. Nor are all unpleasant things bad. Who can decide? You can. And our job is to respect it as it is. No need to dredge it up. Leave it behind. The present is too glorious to spend it weighted down with old baggage.
Don’t carry the past into the future.
What I now want to know is how do I join and where do I sign up for the Tense Stepper fan club ? I think it’s really an alias and it’s Babaji. That’s about the extent of his marching orders .
I do enjoy the way that Babaji hauled around the supreme Avatar saint Hazoorji to meetings worldwide as if to show hey if Hazoorji can do it then anyone can !
The reason , if anyone cares ( and I’m quite sure no one does except me) , I go on about things is because this blog has literally taken the place of back when I used to actually text and email and receive messages back from Gurinder ( after sending and receiving actual letters from him before I was even initiated officially , and then a few afterwards also). Maybe I’ll start putting quotation marks on the things that he said. He accused me of actually caring one time. And now I see why it’s because I’m looking at my creation be totally dismantled from the inside by the leaders and the administration of rssb. Back when I started it America was still a shining world beacon. And towards the end of my reign it was during world war II and America was seen as world saviors and on a higher moral principle than the dictator Hitler. But Gurinder seems to like Hitler. He told me he didn’t care much for Americans. And he could actually say that to an American because I am very open-minded. Half the Americans I don’t care for either so there you go. A world divided. I’m looking at my own creation rssb being diluted and washed down the river and what do I feel? Who cares
LMFAO. I am quite sure that Tense Stepper is really Gurinder Singh honoring my dare to comment and now he’s being called a troll by a so-called devotee who admits he doesn’t have a clue. Don’t worry, I called him worse and that’s how fast I figured him out too.
Gurinder is too clever, by half. What Step 10 Means stay aware: You watch your daily thoughts and actions.Catch mistakes early: You notice when you feel angry, selfish, or dishonest .Fix problems fast: You admit your errors right away instead of hiding them.
Gurinder was one of my favorite students. ( The poor kid had never heard of Townes Van Zandt before I told him who he was. He just knew who the soccer stars were in the West and ACDC). He knew of Socrates Plato and Aristotle but he had yet to digest the meaning of it all until he met his great Avatar Hazoorji.🤣
Never forget how much toenail fudge ( jam ) is involved on the 10th step. He’s so concise that he forgot to laugh. (As a side note I’ve never been asked to give a satsang but I give them anyway ).